ZONE 9 and FLORIDA GARDENING

[Kikiriki]

Thank you Kikiriki . It took us 10 years to get to this stage of drive way. We stil have to seal the asphalt, but much better than the leaf pile we drive on til now. The fron did come with an exisiting concrete straight drive which apparently wasn't enough room for the previous owners as they just parked anywhere in the fron of the house making everything just a big dried out dust bowl. We laid out 4x4's to make the circular part, but funny enough people just thought that was to keep them from driving on the circular part and would pull up into the "yard" up to the 4x4's. Including the mailman . About a year latr we then put out the azaleas to give a clue that someday it would be a yard. The mailman however would still pull up and walk right through the azaleas trampling and breaking them until he had a clear pathway through them. A yaer after that we upped the ante by putting up a split rail fence between the 2 drives out at the road, and would you belive he would just pull along the fence, jump it, and walk through his pathway anyway??...Really!!??!! . I beleive we only "won" because he either quit or moved to another route, as we quit seeing him about 6 months later. The yard now looks like a real yard (always in progress), but no more issues with mail delivery.

ROFL! How crazy!! I cannot imagine sitting in my house and seeing the mailman climbing my fence and trampling my plants! People can be just bizarre! Hey, you do flowers, digginindirt: do you know about starting camellias without rooting powder from cuttings? I have bright green shoots right now: do you use them, or woody tips?

 

[Kikiriki]

Well, we had a break in the rain, so I went out and dug out the potato plants that were near the spill: made me want to cry when I found 8 of the cutest little potatoes growing in the ruined soil...sigh...

On the bright side, though, I now know I can successfully grow a potato! Half of the ones I had started had previously died. I think they got too much water. It was also interesting that some plants had no potatoes started...just all root and greenery. This is a good lesson, because if that happens, it means that I will plan to plant a double crop to make up for those.

My heritage varieties of corn (3) and southern peas have sprouted. I did get them going late, but hopefully they will still produce before the winter.

My beans bush beans are flowering nicely: can't wait for those! Last year I only got a few beans before the monster mole killed my plants... The pole beans are vining nicely, even though I had to move them for the tree cutting (and thank heaven I had so much in pots!). I ended up breaking some of the vines so I was worried I'd killed them. Does anyone know if it will just cause them to produce more vines?

One variety of tomatoes did not survive the powdery mildew. They were making lots of fruit, too... the cinnamon I'd sprinkled on did seem to have an effect as they held on pretty long, but it did not save them. The other variety (heinz heritage) is doing well, but the one fruit that got ripe did not have a flavor I would rave about.

I was thinking my basil seeds must have been bad from my last years crop, but they finally started popping. I am going to have to thin them from the pot where they self-sowed too heavily!

Does anyone else feel bad abouting thinning plants? I feel like it is a waste of a seed if I cannot transplant it! Silly, huh? I know they plants remaining will do better with less competition, but still...

I have not had the heart to dig out my contaminated onions, yet... I hope they were all doing really poorly and not forming bulbs!

 

[digginindirt]

I use an airlayering method on the tree itself. If you pick an area that is more woody but has new growth at the end (approx. 18" or so from the end of branch) you will get good results. Keep in mind they are a slow growth plant so you will be aiming at early fall before actually removing from mother plant. Remove the outer bark and green underlayer on the chosen branch(es) a length of 1 1/2 times the diameter ( 1" diam. = 1 1/2" barkless area). Wrap this area in wet (not soggy) peat moss. Wrap the peat with plastic wrap. Wrap the plastic wrap with aluminum foil. Squirrles are sometimes attracted to foil, so you can spray paint or wrap foil in brown or green to hide from nosey pickers. Check in late summer early fall by removing foil and seeing if you see roots through the plastic. Replace foil if not. If so cut just below foil and remove both wraps NOT THE PEAT MOSS. You can plant in the groung or in a pot, either way water well. They should flower this year, but I would remove all but 2 or so blooms (if they have them) to not overwork the new small root system. Good luck

.

 

[Kikiriki]

I use an airlayering method on the tree itself. If you pick an area that is more woody but has new growth at the end (approx. 18" or so from the end of branch) you will get good results. Keep in mind they are a slow growth plant so you will be aiming at early fall before actually removing from mother plant. Remove the outer bark and green underlayer on the chosen branch(es) a length of 1 1/2 times the diameter ( 1" diam. = 1 1/2" barkless area). Wrap this area in wet (not soggy) peat moss. Wrap the peat with plastic wrap. Wrap the plastic wrap with aluminum foil. Squirrles are sometimes attracted to foil, so you can spray paint or wrap foil in brown or green to hide from nosey pickers. Check in late summer early fall by removing foil and seeing if you see roots through the plastic. Replace foil if not. If so cut just below foil and remove both wraps NOT THE PEAT MOSS. You can plant in the groung or in a pot, either way water well. They should flower this year, but I would remove all but 2 or so blooms (if they have them) to not overwork the new small root system. Good luck . 

Great instructions! You make it sound easy I'll have to get some peat...

 

[Kikiriki]

Fruit trees and animals and growing requirements....

Well I ordered fruit trees that I want even though I am concerned over the required "chill hours" for fruiting. We seem to be having more cold and longer periods of cold in our winters, and I hope to be able to help the trees stay cold by practices such as freezing water bottles placed under insulation around the trunk and roots, as well as covering branches with sun reflecting material. I decided that espalier would be the best way to grow some of the trees to be able to do this, as well as to fit them in my small and overly treed yard. I have two peaches, a weeping plum, and a cherry that all require those chill hours. (these are all dwarfed by rootstocks). I plan to do the cold treatments in conjuction with strong cold fronts. If we have a very warm year, well, so be it...

I also some some mulberry trees: a red white hybrid and a cultivar of white which are large trees, a weeping mulberry that stays low and is pruned to the shape one desires.

In trying to figure out where to put these, I found that the cherry, peaches, and plum all have leaves that are not suitable for the chickens to eat. However, the mulberry leaves are a VERY good feed supplement (fresh and dried) for chickens, ruminants, and cattle. Even horses and giraffes can eat these leaves! I saw a post where a zoo was feeding pruned mulberry to giraffes and an article about horses and mulberry, but I do not have links to them.

The leaf composition of chemicals is very good, but it cannot be the main part of the diet. The info is found here: http://books.google.com/books?hl=en...&q=mulberry tree leaf in poultry feed&f=false

The book linked above discusses that leaves can be harvested several times during the growing season with no detriment to the tree. The dried leaves can be added to food, too.

Mulberry grows across the country (from E to W, N to S) and is a very forgiving plant, although it will need some irrigation in very dry places or bad extended droughts. It is both flood and drought tolerant and can even grow in partial shade as an understory tree, though it will not be a good as one in full sun. The cultivar you select should be suited to your place. The large trees can be pruned down to manageble size, but the roots will still grow broadly unless you make a habit of root pruning. Avoid planting near power lines: you may intend to keep them pruned, but stuff happens!

They also make a good windbreak.

It should not be planted near a house, driveway, sidewalk, or underground utilities (like septic) due to roots, size of the trees which can have brittle branches, as well as the fruits that can stain. Bird droppings will also stain.

 

[digginindirt]

Mulberry can have a very invasive root system. I use a buried double container method on anything with a strong a root system that might cause either foundation issues or invasiveness (wisteria, trumpet vine, muscadine etc.). Since most plants can live well in an above ground container (large terra cotta... I have a kumquat 10 years old still in container), I use same basic concept to agressive guys that I still want in my yard. I bury a very large pot 36" or larger diameter (think hard plastic pond container size) and center desired agressive guy planted into 2nd smaller container 17"-20" (black grow pot with holes in sides and bottom) in larger pot and back fill with either removed soil from hole or mixed slightly with garden soil. The intent is to NOT encourage agressive guy to escape into yard, while still allowing 20 or more years of no need to root prune. They can and will escape from smaller interior pot after girdling until they find the drainage holes,and move out into the larger pot (while minimizing amount of root system that can escape to the size and amount of holes avaiable usually 4-6 side holes and one bottom one). If you have added only potting or garden soil to the larger pot - you wil be encouraging 2nd escape quicker. This also helps with watering during dry seasons as you know exactly where root system is contained if additional watering is needed, and burying keeps more moisture in than above ground pots. I have a freind who I helped with this method who used 1/2 whiskey barrel for a container (with hole drilled) who left the top part of container showing so it looks like a little fence around plant...really kinda cute.

 

[Kikiriki]

I really appreciate your input! I have been thinking of trying something along those lines, but really had no idea how it held up over time. My biggest concerns are the health of the tree due to that root girdling and the increased likelihood of tipping in a storm. We get those high winds all year when storms blow in, but summertime is more a problem because the tree is leafed out, increasing surface area. I do like that containers have a dwarfing affect, though: big scale bonzai! Unfortunately, I have nothing suitable, let alone two suitable containers! I had one, but someone decided they needed it more than I did... Sigh.... I have never understood how people justify stealing to themselves... Stealing food, water, medicine, or clothing for children are the only things I think are excusable.

Anyway, I guess I will keep an eye on craigslist. My yard is just cut every which way by something: power lines across the back and side, water pipes come in on another side, septic and drain field restrict a big area to grass only, then there is the driveway, and the houses (neighbor, too) of course! If I ever get to design a property, all the utilities will be confined to one area that runs along the driveway, even if I have to pay extra!

 

[Kikiriki]

Irony! My DH went grocery shopping and brought home a big bag of greenbeans: the next day I discover my bush beans are LOADED! :/

Corn and southern peas are coming along nicely.

Lost 3 of my tomatos to powdery white mildew. I had one plant of a different variety that responded to the cinnamon treatment... It is now fruiting.

My cucs are flowering madly, but I have to see if ithey set any fruit: my squash never did, it just flowered then died. I have four varieties of cucs going, so hopefully at least one will be productive.

I am thinking about trying to use some of my vertical space. I have PVC Pipe left over, but need caps and fittings, which can add up fast. I would really rather use something other than plastic, too. I would love to use those big glass pickle jars, but I do not eat that many pickles.

I am also thinking about fully enclosing the garden area with wire to keep ot critters (one of my peppers is now naked stem! It had leaves and flowers yesterday!!) it is in an earthbox style plant box, so whatever ate it climbs.

And since I am squeamish about killing my monster horrible mole, i would love to do some real big containers. Money...sigh.... I really do need to kill that pest, though, because it is just mining all over the yard, under the outdoor patio and sidewalk. I keep hoping it will move on, but no such luck!

It looks like I dwarfed some of my amaranth: i had potted it while I worked in the garden, as it had volunteered all over the place. Gave some away, but forgot to put mine in the ground. Also, I think it does not favor full sun...the place I have it now gets more sun than the plants got last year and the leaves look sunburned: conversely, a couple of volunteers popped up right outside the garden, so I just left them there. They have a really deep rich color and big healthy leaves: that area gets only part sun.

Getting my purchased fruit trees in the ground, finally! It required some rearranging to create space. I am still dithering over where the white mulberry should go. The place I want it has power lines, so that's a heck no! The other good sunny spot is too close to the septic and drain field. The side yard would do except there is a giant oak tree there. I do not want to lose that shade: we had it trimmed and now the patio is like a furnace! It would be worse with the tree gone completely...

 

[ljseabreeze]

I moved form Canada to San Diego 10 years ago and it was a big learning curve in the garden. If the weather wasn't a big enough change I also have a huge slope. Watering is a challenge and only the strong plants survive some years. A combination of straw rolls around trees and lots of mulch to keep in moisture has worked for us.

 

[Kikiriki]

I moved form Canada to San Diego 10 years ago and it was a big learning curve in the garden.  If the weather wasn't a big enough change I also have a huge slope.  Watering is a challenge and only the strong plants survive some years.  A combination of straw rolls around trees and lots of mulch to keep in moisture has worked for us.

Thanks for joining us! Mulch is a wonderful thing! The areas where I mulch show significant difference from just plain dirt. Florida tends to be drought or flood. We are so sandy that water just drains away. The normal water table is about 4 to 10 feet down, depending upon how much rain we have had and how how above sea level one is. Due to the high demand on ground water, though, it has been very low for quite a few years. Once it becomes normalized then flooding becomes a problem since we are so low. The sandy soil tends to get hydrophobic, too. So even though we may some years get plenty of rain, if one does not mulch, the plants will still suffer.

I have had the best results since I started using some self watering containers. They really do conserve water, plus they they create extra shade to keep the ground cooler so it looses less moisture. I have trees that fair better than do garden plants, but even they have to be both drought and flood tolerant. I have had to water trees in bad years: even ones that are really well established. I had two orange trees: one died of drought, and the other of flood before I figured out how to deal with our climate.

If you learned in just 10 years, I must applaud you!! What are most and least favorite aspects in the difference between San Diego and Canada gardening?