2 hens in past month with tumors embedded in organs *photo*

[Chickeneering]

Hi you all. I have just put down another hen that seemed to have ascites or an internal laying issue, and put down a similar one a few weeks ago. One hen was a bantam cochin, and one half salmon faverolle/half cochin. I noticed a slight waddle in both a few weeks ago, but since the birds still seemed lively and happy at that point, I didn't do anything. Both were 3 or 4 years old, both were full of fluid (the hen I culled today had some cheesy egg yolks too), and both had gnarly internal organs that I am amazed worked at all.

The intestines were shrunken and full of tumor-like growths that formed what seemed a complete obstruction in certain places (I cut these open, and sometimes they were solid, sometimes with a hollow pocket full of fluid). The interior walls of the abdom also had embedded growths, and there was lots of hard, rumply connective tissue between all the organs (very hard to remove from abdominal cavity), and as large clumps attached but free-floating, and today's hen also had a growth on the end of the breastbone that was tender when I pressed on it. For both birds, I couldn't locate the heart, but lungs, gizzards, and livers looked normal.

I wish I had put both of them down much sooner, but I had no idea their insides were as bad as they were (I did initially drain a lot of fluid out the first hen while still alive, but then decided to cull). I didn't notice the poop of the first, but the second had thin droppings and what looked like a cheesy buildup on the vent. Both were still eating and drinking (not eating very much, though), and taking part in normal chicken life, albeit a bit sluggishly, and the hen today was in obvious pain. I am nervous that this is something transmissible, or (probably less likely, diet-related), because the birds are not related, have never had regular contact, yet had the same issue. Due to supply chain issues here on the island, I have switched their regular food a number of times within the past year, since I couldn't consistently get the same thing. I have been alternating between all-purpose feed and layer pellets, sometimes with different brands for both.

Something I have noticed in my flock in the past year or so is that many have somewhat droopy eyelids (not severely, just like their eyes aren't all the way open, or they look tired), and sometimes look pale. I noticed that when I put the first hen down, the feather eating that was happening in her pen stopped, and I'm currently seeing feather-eating in my other pen of bantams, from a hen who is similar in age to these two. Another oddity is that the eye color of one of my roosters has changed from orange to green, and the eye itself also responds differently than it used to. All the birds are penned on dirt floors to which I add grass clippings, and they take turns free ranging on different days. Occasionally I will see them eating one of two poisonous plants (Wedelia trilobata and Ageratum conyzoides), but usually not in great quantities. Recently I noticed that the 55 gallon barrel I get their water from (rainwater collection) was starting to rust, and it was painted on the inside, so I'm not sure if maybe they were exposed to toxins that way.

Does it look like something familiar to anyone? Pictures show organs from bird 1, a cut-open mass from bird 1, and organs from bird 2.

 

[azygous]

Yes, unfortunately. The tumors and the eye color change point to late Marek's and ocular Marek's. If the livers in the two hens you cut open were of normal size, that also points to Marek's.

Have you had any young birds between two months and a year go lame and then deteriorate, having to be euthanized?

 

[Chickeneering]

Yes, unfortunately. The tumors and the eye color change point to late Marek's and ocular Marek's. If the livers in the two hens you cut open were of normal size, that also points to Marek's.

Have you had any young birds between two months and a year go lame and then deteriorate, having to be euthanized?

Oh no I had been shying away from the thought of Marek's because I've seen no neurological issues whatsoever, though I did have one young bird die suddenly in the past few months, but she had a weirdly-spotted liver. No lameness - everyone so far has been functional.

If most seem generally ok (I have 25 birds total), can I let them live out their lives until they seem uncomfortable, or is it better to cull sooner than later? I have no plans for flock expansion, but most of my young hens are laying and fairly vigorous.

 

[Chickeneering]

Yes, unfortunately. The tumors and the eye color change point to late Marek's and ocular Marek's. If the livers in the two hens you cut open were of normal size, that also points to Marek's.

Have you had any young birds between two months and a year go lame and then deteriorate, having to be euthanized?

Oh! Come to think of it, this very same hen I culled this morning had an episode maybe a year or so ago. She was having trouble walking all of a sudden, and I thought she wasn't going to make it, and her neck was funny I think, but I spent a lot of time hand-feeding her and she got better. So maybe that was a signal, or the onset?

I think I now remember also that the young bird who died suddenly might have been unable to keep her head off the ground, or walk, or something like that. I don't remember well. I think I saw that one standing immobile and somewhat unresponsive in the same place for a really long time, so I isolated her, and towards the end she was having trouble moving. But again, her organs looked ok, except for the liver.

 

[Chickeneering]

All that said, I was image-searching Marek's tumors, and I came across this photo which looks exactly like my hens' organs: https://www.researchgate.net/figure...racterized-by-the-pedunculated_fig2_258338254

Apparently it's a spontaneous thing, and only in hens? I have had two roosters die suddenly and for no apparent reason within the past year or two, though.

 

[azygous]

There are so many signs, I'd bet you have Marek's in your flock. But lymphoid leucosis has many of the same symptoms.

Have you hatched chicks from within your flock? Leucosis is passed directly from a hen carrying the virus to the embryo in the egg. Embryo mortality is very high with leucosis.

Marek's does not pass from hen to egg. But exposure to dander and feces will cause chicks to become infected from a hen carrying the virus. Those often become paralyzed and die within the first year.

Both viruses are common, but leucosis is much shorter lived in the environment while Marek's virus lasts around one year, therefore harder to eradicate. If you have another chicken come down with these symptoms, you should get a necropsy to confirm which virus you're flock has. Then you will be better able to deal with it.

 

[Chickeneering]

There are so many signs, I'd bet you have Marek's in your flock. But lymphoid leucosis has many of the same symptoms.

Have you hatched chicks from within your flock? Leucosis is passed directly from a hen carrying the virus to the embryo in the egg. Embryo mortality is very high with leucosis.

Marek's does not pass from hen to egg. But exposure to dander and feces will cause chicks to become infected from a hen carrying the virus. Those often become paralyzed and die within the first year.

Both viruses are common, but leucosis is much shorter lived in the environment while Marek's virus lasts around one year, therefore harder to eradicate. If you have another chicken come down with these symptoms, you should get a necropsy to confirm which virus you're flock has. Then you will be better able to deal with it.

Thanks for the info. It's just weird that they'd have a virus (unless one transmitted through the egg), since I haven't acquired any new birds in the last five years, and the spontaneous deaths only started in the last year or two with my F3's and one original hatchery bird. Could those viruses could be spread by wild doves?

Most of my flock comes from breeding a few hatchery and a few local birds. I think the ovarian carcinoma is its own issue, but there might be overlap with one of the viruses, and I might be dealing with more than one thing. The birds I culled and the ones that died suddenly looked very different internally.

I did save and refridgerate a tissue sample in case I can find somewhere to send it. I had no luck after searching exhaustively for a local lab to send a dead bird to the last time someone died, but I'll try again.

 

[cocosandy]

Mareks is in feather dust so if you think that people who drive to the feed store from various coops may have it on their shoes and on their tires then you can see that its everywhere. The vaccine only works on the paralyzing brain tumors. Chickens still get tumors from it. Wild birds and rodents can also spread it. There is no way to get rid of all chicken dust unless you want to do a hatchery level bio security system, and that is pretty impossible unless your birds never go out. Sometimes it can be something else as noted in a comment above so its best to search out your state poultry extension and see if you can send in a dead chicken on ice to be necropsied. Our state vet used to have a pickup service but it got defunded (CT) so what I do now is to collect styrofoam coolers that fit in a box or even old actual coolers from tag sales (small ones.) If a bird dies and I am concerned I triple bag the bird, keep it refrigerated but not frozen, pack it in the styrofoam with ice packs and overnight it via FedEx to the state vet. They have a form to download and then they bill later. I always ask for full testing and its not that expensive. In CT you get a gross necropsy report about what the vet/student saw and then also a final report with labs. We also can call and talk to the technician or vet about findings. Problem is that many techs (and often the vets themselves) don't know all that much about backyard chickens. Everything from the Mareks Vaccine to medication rules for chickens is aimed at factory farms and keeping chickens on their feet long enough to lay or become meat. Still, they can do testing that we cant do at home so its sort of important to at least send one in if you can. In the US each state should have a vet extension. Often this is at a major state university. Follow their rules for packing and never freeze a chicken that you are sending in. Just get it out asap because it should be necropsied within 48 hours. If I work fast enough when something happens I can usually use second day delivery because the vet extension here is around 4 hours away from me so its just a drive and very inexpensive to send. Be sure to at least triple bag and wrap with a chuck or dog wee wee pad in case of leaks. I assume that all chickens are exposed to Mareks but I still vaccinate any that I hatch in the incubator on days 1-2 depending on how the hatch goes. I actually didn't think that your pics looked that bad. Could be Mareks mixed with internal laying or some-such. If a chicken here drops their head or stargazes the first thing I do is to inject some B Complex into them. That often does the trick. It may still have Mareks but sometimes its a vitamin issue...Its worth a try anyway.