attack was the stray rotweiller!

[Sabz]

Yes, I have the same feeling here also!

I live almost the same situation you had with the bar. A crazy cat lady moved in next door (a real crazy one). She had a lot of cats (I thought 50, my neighbour says 100).
I tried to be friends with the neighbours, offered to clean the cats, take pictures, post on internet to find homes..
One day there was a fair in our small city, with animals and agriculture information.
The neighbours and I went together. We had to pay 10$ to get in. After about 6-7 minutes, we didn't even walk around all the fair (and it is a very small one) that the woman said: I gotta go home for the cats.

She really had mental health issues. She could not be separated from her cats for more than 10 minutes.
She was kicked out of the previous city where she lived. They had to have a new floor done at the house they were renting, because of all the cat pee. They also bought new mattresses and couches. And now she did all the same to the neighbour's house - and they lived there 10 months only!!! Talk about money wasted for illegal cats (our city allows only 2 per household).

And yet, I am the only one fighting these cats. The other neighbours feed them!! Some other people complained to the city, but after being told they wouldn't do anything, they just stopped trying.

I think people might live a pretty pink dream fairy tale in regards to stray animals. We live in a place where it goes to -40 in winter. No water, no food sources available. Plus, with a population of cats this high in a small range, they would NEVER survive. They will live a painful winter and probably die of starvation after a few of their body parts freeze and fall off. The cat lovers that feed them just encourage this. When they'll leave for Florida in February, the little kittens will be all alone with no food. But they don't think about that. Oh no. Cats are cute.

I think the best thing (for cat lovers) would be to re-home the stray cats. NOT feed them!!! How can they not think about that?! Makes neighbours happy, complies with the law, gives a loving and warm home to the creature. Everyone's happy. The end.

Sorry for the OP, getting a bit side tracked. I hope your flock is OK. You mentioned blood everywhere and then "all birds ok" so I wasn't sure if the blood was from your chickens or the dog.

 

[speckledhen]

Quote: See, you have to be very careful here, Sabz. This is close to moralizing. This section is not for that. As far as "detaching" myself, I don't need to do that. I'm fine with shooting problem predators, which is what a dog on my property is that does not belong to me (see sig line). Wish we didn't have to think about that, but it's the way it has to be.

A swift kill shot is not animal cruelty. Animal cruelty is a different subject altogether. No one wants animal cruelty supported. But, allowing a domestic dog to roam, jeopardizing the dog itself as well as livestock, other wildlife and humans it encounters, IS animal cruelty/neglect.

As far as cats go, had not seen any in quite a long time, probably due to the coyotes and foxes here. We had a stray tomcat show up at the beginning of November, obviously over a year of age, not neutered, no collar, no idea where he came from. No one knew who he was, tried to find his owner, no luck. He was certainly an indoor cat at some point from the way he reacted to things here. He does not bother the chickens at all and probably does a service keeping mice/rats on the run. I've not seen him chase a wild bird at all here, not really that motivated. But, the point is, someone probably dumped this non neutered male to fertilize and propagate and now, thanks to help from my friend at one of the local Humane Societies, he is neutered, has his rabies and feline 4 vaccinations and will not be a burden in this county. They were unable to take him in, all local organizations were full to overflowing with cats this year. I did my part with one cat and that is all I am financially able to do. Any others will not be as fortunate, I'm afraid. If a colony of ferals started causing trouble, guess we'd have to use some lead in that case, sadly.

To the OP, I sure hope you can figure out how to solve this rottie issue. Please, again, be careful.

 

[bobbi-j]

Sabz - it does depend entirely upon where one lives. Living in Canada with restrictions on firearms, your options are limited. That's all I can say about that. In MN, it's against the law to discharge a firearm within 500' of a dwelling. So, if you live in a town or city, you need to call law enforcement, animal control, the dog warden or whatever other authorities fit your situation. I happen to live on a farm. Our nearest neighbor is a mile away. Therefore, shooting is an option for us. There is no clear cut answer for any situation. What works for me on the prairie on MN is not going to work for some backyard chicken keeper in Dallas or San Francisco...

 

[Sabz]

I know Bobbi, that's why I need to read the law. I suppose there is a clean line in there.. well.. hopefully?!
In regards to firearms, I have no problem to follow the law and do what I am supposed to do to get one - if I am allowed to use it for the purpose I need to. I will check, I think the best is to read the laws. I won't know otherwise, since police refuses to answer. And for talking to the city, animal control, etc.. My city is cheap, they have no contract with animal control. They don't want to pay for the feral cats.
Animal control will charge me minimum 400$ for those. So.. it ended up that the solution would probably be killing them. So.. back to reading the law

See, you have to be very careful here, Sabz. This is close to moralizing. This section is not for that. As far as "detaching" myself, I don't need to do that. I'm fine with shooting problem predators, which is what a dog on my property is that does not belong to me (see sig line). Wish we didn't have to think about that, but it's the way it has to be.

A swift kill shot is not animal cruelty. Animal cruelty is a different subject altogether. No one wants animal cruelty supported. But, allowing a domestic dog to roam, jeopardizing the dog itself as well as livestock, other wildlife and humans it encounters, IS animal cruelty/neglect.

I think it is pretty clear I was not passing judgement or moralizing. I also said I was sorry if I sounded harsh. English not being my main language, I don't always sound as I should. I also said I supported killing an animal if it harms us. I've never even mentioned cruelty in this regards. Cruelty is feeding an animal and letting it "survive" through winter and leaving on vacation with the animal having nothing to eat.

It is just that yes, it is called killing. Yes, I said "all this killing". Yes, many posts on this forum mention it. Saying "all this killing" is not rude and is not a judgement. It is a plain realistic view on all the post that mention this as a solution. Sorry if you feel offended. In no way I mean to offend anyone doing this - unless your intentions are to hurt the animal or the owner intentionally. Don't try to pick a fight, I am not against you. This being said, this looks like the post will turn bad so I will not return.

I feel bad, I didn't want to start a fight but I think some people are not able to discuss this subject without feeling like they are being attacked or aggressed. I was not against these actions, I just needed to understand how it was done in regards of laws and neighbours - how do you cross eyes with a neighbour that knows you killed its dogs? But my really simple choice of words by saying "all this killing" has made people mad at me. Sorry, just telling the truth and this was in NO WAY a judgement of the action taken.

I am sorry, I did not want to sound negative towards this post. Goodbye!

 

[speckledhen]

@Sabz, I'm sorry if you took offense. We may be misunderstanding each other a little bit, especially if English is not your first language. I'm just meaning to say that the general rules of Predators & Pest say we should not pass judgement on how we each deal with our predator situations. Hazard of being a former moderator, I guess.

 

[SixChickFlock]

re: Cats. Solutions... ?

There are two cats in my household. Sometimes three. Neighbor cats and feral cats visit my yard everyday... Cutting through to avoid a long alley walk. A couple will sometimes perch on my patio for a few minutes and watch the hens forage, but have never been aggressive towards them. They seem to fear the large birds. So I don't know that cats are a problem for chickens... At least not mine, so far.

In Chicago, I have heard of a group (Cats At Work) that captures feral cats, fixes them up and returns them to new territories. Having them "on the job" helps keep the city rodent population down. Having them fixed, keeps the feral cat population down.

"The cats are humanely managed by volunteer caretakers for the entirety of their lives with ongoing support from Tree House as mandated by Cook County’s 'Managed Care of Feral Cats Ordinance'."

Best of luck to all who have predator problems... Keep your flocks safe and happy!

 

[speckledhen]

re: Cats. Solutions... ?

There are two cats in my household. Sometimes three. Neighbor cats and feral cats visit my yard everyday... Cutting through to avoid a long alley walk. A couple will sometimes perch on my patio for a few minutes and watch the hens forage, but have never been aggressive towards them. They seem to fear the large birds. So I don't know that cats are a problem for chickens... At least not mine, so far.

In Chicago, I have heard of a group (Cats At Work) that captures feral cats, fixes them up and returns them to new territories. Having them "on the job" helps keep the city rodent population down. Having them fixed, keeps the feral cat population down.

"The cats are humanely managed by volunteer caretakers for the entirety of their lives with ongoing support from Tree House as mandated by Cook County’s 'Managed Care of Feral Cats Ordinance'."

Best of luck to all who have predator problems... Keep your flocks safe and happy!

Speaking of ferals, there is some organization who traps and neuters them around here, but I saw that they actually cut off the tip of one ear of every one they do so the cat can be ID's in the future. I understand why, but it sort of bugs me.

 

[CrazyTalk]

Ear tipping cats is pretty universal - it's the best way to mark a feral such that you can tell it has been neutered without actually catching it. Done properly, it does no more damage than putting tags in the ear of a sheep or cow.


Someone mentioned that in the US most people have the right to shoot anything harming livestock. They specifically mentioned raptors. Before someone gets themselves arrested, shooting a raptor is a federal crime, and there's nowhere in the US where you can legally shoot a raptor without going through a permitting process. Some states are easier to get than others, but legally all are required by federal law to track this.

 

[gawildlife]

It's called TNR or Trap, Neuter and Release and in the opinion of many is an abject failure.

It does not lessen the dire environmental impact of non native invasive predators upon native flora and fauna.
It does not lesson the increased risk of zoonotic diseases like rabies, distemper, parvo and many others.
It actually INCREASES the number of large predators like coyotes.

http://www.tnrrealitycheck.com/failure.asp


Ask yourself this question.

If dog lovers did this would it be allowed?

 

[speckledhen]

Ear tipping cats is pretty universal - it's the best way to mark a feral such that you can tell it has been neutered without actually catching it. Done properly, it does no more damage than putting tags in the ear of a sheep or cow.


Someone mentioned that in the US most people have the right to shoot anything harming livestock. They specifically mentioned raptors. Before someone gets themselves arrested, shooting a raptor is a federal crime, and there's nowhere in the US where you can legally shoot a raptor without going through a permitting process. Some states are easier to get than others, but legally all are required by federal law to track this.

I can tell you that was not me who said anything about raptors. You can get permits for it, as I understand it, as you said, but every time I speak about shooting anything to protect livestock, I am never speaking of airborne predators. Just want to make that perfectly clear.


I get the ear tipping thing, as I said, I understand why, but I came across it at a thrift store recently, petting their store cat and noticed it was missing an ear tip. When I said something, that's when the store owner told me why it was missing. I'd just never heard it before. I don't even like toe punching chickens, it's just me, just can't do it, so it was along those lines.