BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[hellbender]

We supply ourselves and a lot of our family (and even some of their friends, neighbors, and extended family) with eggs. This year I plan on providing ourselves and some of our family with meat as well as selling chicks and hatching eggs. The market here for mixed breed chicks and eggs is very, very good - particularly if the parent stock is rare and attractive. I'm also building a small army of large fowl broodies to make the flock relatively self-sustaining.

The current flock is starting their cock/hen year and consists of:

SS Hamburgs
RC Brown Leghorns
Blue Andalusians
Black Langshans
Barred Rocks
Speckled Sussex
Dark Brahmas
and a Welsummer

Pullets on order for mid-March are:

Redcaps
Cream Brabanters
Norwegian Jaerhons
Gold Campines
SG Dorkings
Buff Laced Polish (for our daughter)
Partridge Chanteclers
Spangled Russian Orloffs
New Hampshires
Buff Orpingtons (for our daughter)
LF Buff Cochins (for our daughter)
Salmon Faverolles (for our daughter)
Barnevelders
Easter Eggers
Olive Eggers
Cornish X


A local gal has raised Cornish X pullets to laying age, crossed them with a heavy breed cock (Orpington comes to mind, but I don't remember her exact cross), and essentially ends up with offspring that performs like the red/black broilers. I'd like to try my hand at crossing them to my Langshan for some meaties. I'm really hoping one of my b*tc*y Brahmas will go broody at an appropriate time to shove the CX chicks under her so they can start ranging asap.

Our daughter is getting "pet" chicks in exchange for us killing off her beloved Polish cock. I'm very pleased to have steered her away from the Silkies and towards LF breeds. She insisted on some Polish girls though.



hellbender, you think the Buckeyes might make a good addition to my wild assortment? I could easily swap out some straight run chicks from my Meyer order for some Buckeye pullets.

Honestly...you have so many breeds, I don't know that one more would do you good or badly.

 

[RedRidge]

Hello Leah's Mom,
As a professional scientist I abandoned scales more than 60 years ago as they are not dependable for accurate weights.  This is referring to weights less than say five kilograms, of course.  During all that time I have been dependent upon my own personal balance.  A balance is far superior to a scale as the latter is dependent on internal springs which are notoriously untrustworthy. Springs tend to stretch and they vary in tension according to the relative humidity and ambient temperature.  On one pan the desired weight is placed either in English measure or in metric weights.  On the opposing pan a piece of filter paper is placed and one simply keeps adding small increments of whatever is to be weighed until the pans balance and the center needle stabilizes at the zero point. Note: One brings the pans to equilibrium after the piece of filter paper is placed on the second pan in order to negate the effect of the weight of the filter paper itself. Then the substance to be weighed is added until the desired weight is achieved. The more sophisticated balance has one to 5 bars on which are calibrated an array of sliding weights.  One sets the item to be weighed on one pan and the weights on the bars are slid until level balance is achieved as indicated by the center needle achieving zero point.  In order to see how this simple system works take your new balance to your pharmacist as most take great delight in teaching skills. He will be glad to show you how these goals are accomplished. That is all there is to it!
Neal, the Zooman

LOL
With multiple degrees here in both science and engineering i can assure you that this isn't rocket science. ;-)
We are simply trying to establish relative baselines for consumption and output. It's called calculating EPDs and most livestock people who are serious about culling and profitability calculate EPDs on all their livestock. The quickest and easiest way to do that, with hundreds of head of livestock especially, is a certified scale of any variety. It is more than accurate enough for this purpose. We have so many scales around here I'm not even sure I can count. From a jewelers gram scale all the way to a 400 lb calf scale.
We are not weighing nuclear material for a fussion reaction... just record keeping for general farm business models. And efficiency is a huge part of any business model

 

[DesertChic]

Different ages/stages/types of chickens require different levels of various nutrients. The following publication is available as a free download, and has recommendations for white-egg chicks, layers and breeders; brown egg chicks, layers and breeders; and broiler (CornishX) chicks and breeders. Use whichever recommendation is closest to your chickens' age and intended use.

Nutrient Requirements of Poultry:

Ninth Revised Edition, 1994 (1994)


Best wishes,
Angela

Thank you!!!

 

[bramblefir]

Honestly...you have so many breeds, I don't know that one more would do you good or badly.

Haha! I can't disagree with you there. I would really like to settle down with just one or two breeds in the future. I just need to be able to handle representatives of each breed I have an interest in to know whether they'll suit me in the long run or not. From my 2014 birds I've found that the only breeds I'd be interested in continuing with would be the Speckled Sussex and the Langshan.

 

[hellbender]

Haha! I can't disagree with you there. I would really like to settle down with just one or two breeds in the future. I just need to be able to handle representatives of each breed I have an interest in to know whether they'll suit me in the long run or not. From my 2014 birds I've found that the only breeds I'd be interested in continuing with would be the Speckled Sussex and the Langshan.

Well, in that case, perhaps you should pick up a few Buckeyes...both cockerels and pullet....they might soon become you favorites.

 

[hellbender]

Well, in that case, perhaps you should pick up a few Buckeyes...both cockerels and pullet....they might soon become you favorites.

Apropo...my family and I kept (still keep) Australorps and NN/Turkens for several decades but since we have decided to absolutely stop selling eggs to the public, we are going to essentially eliminate all breeds except our meat birds and meat bird experimental projects.

We're not going to screw around with it either....this will be done by march. Other than our 'show' project with NNs, we will likely have nothing here but Buckeyes and Dark Cornish. Pretty darned radical directions for us.

My son in Ky will continue with the Buckeyes over NN pullets because it's gotten under his skin from the historical connection but from a point very soon, every egg that's laid here will either be eaten by someone/something here
or hatched for our meat flock, to be sexually altered or add to the breeding gang. (Again, show birds excepted).

EDIT: Due to new developments, our layer breeds will be out of here by by mid-Feb., thanks to Mr. and Mrs. Giampaolo who live near Indian Head Maryland. They have family here who are my friends and they were instrumental in helping to locate the buyers....(going quite cheap'.

I really did NOT want to resort to my usual method of dispersing birds but that would have worked...I do have lots of dogs to feed.

As a point of discussion, I had to 're-possess' the hybrid pups from my son in KY...not for any other reason than his hired man simply couldn't handle the dogs. I gave him a Heeler male pup to work with...Still a lot of dog but without the balk...lol

 

[Arielle]

Quote: I bought my buckeyes last spring and they freerange during the day. We love the. THe biggest heaviest birds we have ever had. Understand that they are the first real bredder bred birds we have had. Excepting the AMeraucana from GFF, for w hat that is worth. Mostly cckls and they seem to get along given the space they are allowed. And they tend to run off other roosters. But only once did one have the misstep of flogging me-- only once. ANother tried the wing dance for a few days -- guess my response ( walking away) was not very encouraging. lol

Mine are from Chris McCary in AL. ALBC stock and Mr. ______ sorry drawing a blank. There is also Mr Rhodes in MA and several other breeders depending if you are looking for a meat line or a line pushed for eggs. Dang pretty birds.

Quote: I'm surprised Donna lasted as long as she did. You can recreate DOnnas super blue egg layers yourself .

When you guys use a dual purpose bird for meat, do you feed them a "broiler" diet or a "layer" diet? I hope to raise at least some of my NN Turkens for meat and I'm not sure if I should feed them differently from my egg layers.

During the growing phase the emphasis should be for growth of bone and meat. A layer diet allows for extra calcium for the formation of an egg a day. THat is a lot of calcium for a non laying bird focused on growth. Definitely needs enough calcium and phosphorus for the bone growth but not as much as for egg shell formation. As for protein. I'm all for natural sources if possible, ie meat or incest. THe methionine is the most limiting and that is why it is synthetically made and added to feed. I can understand it for horse feed as horses are not meat eaters but also need it for growth; but chickens are meat eaters so I'm comfortable with meat sources. Just haven't found any locally so I supplement with house hold leftovers.

CHris McCthy said to feed 27 percent protein to my buckeyes for the first 8 weeks for a great start. Usually layer feed is not fed until about the time the first eggs appear.

I'm hoping to start a hatch next week. This week is supposed to be very cold, lows in the single digits and some highs in the low 20's. Will this affect fertility and hatchability? I was thinking of collecting eggs a few times a day to prevent freezing. Is that good enough or should I wait until temps aren't so frigid?

I was also curious on washing the eggs. I've heard that you should and some say you shouldn't. Any thoughts?

Brrrr too cold to hatch eggs-- I collected twice today . And about half were already cracked due to the extreme cold. lol Good for scrambled eggs!!! Yum-- lunch.

I only wash very dirty eggs or if the egg got covered with a broken egg goo. I prefer to dip washed eggs in dilute bleach solution. Actually I prefer not to use soiled eggs and usually p *** on using them.

Project(s) for the upcoming year.....

1. Crossbreeding Freedom ranger hens to Orpington rooster to see what happens. I'm hoping to develop a faster growing self-sustaining meat focused bird.
2. Searching around to see if someone has already accomplished what I am attemping in #1
3. Crossbreeding Orpington rooster to Plymouth rock hens to see how fast/slow the offspring matures at various times.
4. My husband dug out his feeds and foraging textbook from college. He's working on tweaking the feed we get from the local mill.

 

[hellbender]

Here is a pic of an intact hybrid cock representing Buckeye over Dark Cornish. nothing like the standard Cornish X for rapid (too rapid) growth but these can be dressed to about 6.5 pounds at 16 to 18 weeks, being quite tender but still have a lot more flavor than that soggy mess found in big-box stores.

 

[draye]

Here is a pic of an intact hybrid cock representing Buckeye over Dark Cornish. nothing like the standard Cornish X for rapid (too rapid) growth but these can be dressed to about 6.5 pounds at 16 to 18 weeks, being quite tender but still have a lot more flavor than that soggy mess found in big-box stores.

Nice.

 

[Arielle]

Here is a pic of an intact hybrid cock representing Buckeye over Dark Cornish. nothing like the standard Cornish X for rapid (too rapid) growth but these can be dressed to about 6.5 pounds at 16 to 18 weeks, being quite tender but still have a lot more flavor than that soggy mess found in big-box stores.

Look at that full round breast!

Now that I have the buckeyes, this is a cross that I have thought about.

I did have 3 Cornish rock crosses. The Cornish rock pullets were bred to buff orpington or black copper marans roosters. THe survivability of the Cornish rocks definitely was not the best, and in the long run I hesitated to continue this angle of adding in fast growth. None of the three breed crosses made it to a year old. Hence my thinking moved to the dark Cornish. FInding a good production line of Cornish seems to be the usual work to find a good line for this type of production.