Chicken Drama- please help!

[Kayla's Lunch]

I only had time to glance at it. I couldn't see what exactly they studied. There are lots of FDA approved drugs that turn out to be harmful. Anyone doing a study can choose how to do it, and they may not do it right. Even among homeopaths, there is disagreement on the "right" was to prescribe and to dose. Some people use the little pellets straight, some insist the pellet has to be dissolved in water. Some just don't know how to recognize symptoms and then can't possibly select the right remedy. I took one dog to 2 vets. They both had very good reputations in the holistic community, one was even nationally known. They each prescribed a different remedy for the dog and neither was helpful. It wasn't until a few years after that, when I really started to learn about homeopathy, that I realized those vets didn't really understand homeopathy and that was why they couldn't use it correctly. When I occasionally need to take one of my kids (11, 14, 16) to the doctor, the doctors are surprised to find out that the kids have never had antibiotics, ibuprofen, Tylenol, cough medicine, allergy medicine, etc. Several years ago, the doctor said 2 of them had ear infections and they needed antibiotics. I took them home, gave them a remedy, and about an hour later they were better. People can be affected by placebos (which all medicine can fall in that category), but animals can't. No study can convince me that what I have lived for the past 10+ years wasn't real.

 

[Cyprus]

Everyone has different opinions, let's leave it at that. We don't need to get another thread shut down.

 

[CarpCharacin]

Animals are in fact affected by the placebo effect.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19912522

Sure, a single study may have flaws, but systematic reviews incorporate data from many different, independent studies, and they provide a very high level of evidence, which far outstrips the purely anecdotal evidence that homeopathy is based off of. Homeopathy lacks scientific underpinnings, and attacking science-based medicine doesn't mitigate that.

 

[cottagecheese]

@CarpCharacin, even someone like me, who is relatively new to homeopathy, has actually heard of that study - it's famous LOL, meaning a famous scandal. It has everything - conflicts of interest, procedural and research flaws, reporting inaccuracies. Look what my friend duckduckgo found out for me:

NHMRC did the review twice - the first review was never made public (obviously it must've been favorable to homeopathy)
NHMRC misled the public - they said the findings of the 2015 report were based on a "rigorous assessment of over 1800 studies". In fact the findings were based on only 176 papers. (They must have picked and chosen only what fit their bias) https://nexusnewsfeed.com/article/h...premiere-exposes-australian-research-scandal/ Excellent trailer here, please watch.

Some unbiased studies https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3833578/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1298309/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20175887
Could the skeptics have a look here https://www.homeopathycenter.org/quotable-homeopathic-research That's Christmas in July for homeopathy.

@Willowspirit, you mean you took the dog to a homeopathic vet? If she got worse, why did you continue the treatment for three weeks? Nothing should be given for more than a few days if there is no response. No professional homeopath could have been involved here. Did you medicate yourself? How long did you study? What potencies did you use? Please give particulars, your account sounds very unusual.

@Kayla's Lunch thanks for confirming that the future is bright - you've got ten years on me. I'm a fresh convert, and like all new converts - quite the zealot!

@Cyprus, a whole system of medicine has been slandered, a response must be given, and remember, this is all so that young people know that they have options. Why would the thread be shut down? It is a very civilized discussion.

 

[MomJones]

I have been using homeopathy for about 10 years. Like many different teachers, doctors, car mechanics, etc., some are better at their trade than others. I have had 2 different dogs in the past in seriously bad conditions. I took them to numerous vets, spent thousands of dollars and got no where. At one point the vets were strongly encouraging me to put the one dog down. In both cases, once connected to a good homeopath, in one week, the dogs made "miraculous" recoveries. I saw all my vet bills, as well as human doctor bills, go way down since using homeopathy. Homeopathy is my main form of health care for all the humans and animals in my household. Studies can be run to accomplish whatever they want. I'm sticking with what I have seen first hand what homeopathy can do.

 

[MomJones]

I only had time to glance at it. I couldn't see what exactly they studied. There are lots of FDA approved drugs that turn out to be harmful. Anyone doing a study can choose how to do it, and they may not do it right. Even among homeopaths, there is disagreement on the "right" was to prescribe and to dose. Some people use the little pellets straight, some insist the pellet has to be dissolved in water. Some just don't know how to recognize symptoms and then can't possibly select the right remedy. I took one dog to 2 vets. They both had very good reputations in the holistic community, one was even nationally known. They each prescribed a different remedy for the dog and neither was helpful. It wasn't until a few years after that, when I really started to learn about homeopathy, that I realized those vets didn't really understand homeopathy and that was why they couldn't use it correctly. When I occasionally need to take one of my kids (11, 14, 16) to the doctor, the doctors are surprised to find out that the kids have never had antibiotics, ibuprofen, Tylenol, cough medicine, allergy medicine, etc. Several years ago, the doctor said 2 of them had ear infections and they needed antibiotics. I took them home, gave them a remedy, and about an hour later they were better. People can be affected by placebos (which all medicine can fall in that category), but animals can't. No study can convince me that what I have lived for the past 10+ years wasn't real.

You're one of the good ones. Stay strong girl.

 

[MomJones]

Animals are in fact affected by the placebo effect.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19912522

Sure, a single study may have flaws, but systematic reviews incorporate data from many different, independent studies, and they provide a very high level of evidence, which far outstrips the purely anecdotal evidence that homeopathy is based off of. Homeopathy lacks scientific underpinnings, and attacking science-based medicine doesn't mitigate that.

Well said. Except that scientific findings have to be interpreted by humans, all of whom have their own biases. Statistics classes are fascinating for that very reason: each scientific report carries it's own conclusion and conclusions are affected by the people providing that conclusion. Therefore, one can use statistical analysis all day long to support their own biases.

 

[aart]

Therefore, one can use statistical analysis all day long to support their own biases.

Or one can use purely anecdotal 'analysis'.
The placebo effects of belief systems cannot be underestimated.

 

[Kiki]

I have 19 hens and 1 roo. For the last year or so, due to repeated attacks and flock loss, I increased my run size and limit free range time. (They still get about an hour a day or so of free ranging.) So I noticed this spring (End of April/May) that some of the girls were molting. They are about a year and a half old, variety of breeds. No biggie. At the same time, we had a never ending stretch of rain. Weeks of rain left a sloppy and GROSS run, as well as limited range time. I did my best to keep them out of the muck, and keep fresh water. Their feathers were all kinds of crazy. 6 or 7 had naked butts, a few had naked necks, and then I noticed a few had bare backs, which I assumed was aggravated by the rooster. some of them had diarrhea. I started to get really worried. Then, one day I saw a roundworm.
We had a gap in rain, so I attacked with DE, started adding ACV in the water, threw herbs in the nest boxes. I also started feeding feather fixer. I also started getting eggs with runny yolks. (I have dealt with that one other time a few years ago. Annoying, but it eventually passed.) After a week or so, I bought a soothing mite spray (Couldn't get close enough), mite spray for boxes and roosts, and also tried the natural worming pellets (Strike pellets.) After another week or two, some of the girls got feathers back, but not all. Most poo is normal, egg yolks firmed back up. I added a better dusting area to the run. No signs of worms anywhere.
Last week, I noticed that a few of the hens have just never bounced back. There are STILL a few naked butts and backs with no pin feathers in sight. Diarrhea seems to be making a comeback, but it has been brutally hot and humid here. I am still feeding feather fixer. TODAY- I went to use eggs, (I gather every other day) and I had to crack 12 to get 4 usable eggs. The others were all watery, and most had extensive lines of blood and traces of an embryo. (SEE PICS)How in the world can that happen in 2 days? ( I do have three crazy broody hens but I cannot get them to break so I gave up- which I know I shouldn't have.) Everything seems to be a MESS.
So my questions are...
How do I treat them or do I need to? If I should worm, do I go with strong stuff or something like Zyfend A so I don't have to throw out eggs?
Do I separate or get rid of the roo so they can have a break and their backs can regrow?
I plan to go back to getting the eggs every day now.
Is all of this because of worms and possible mites? Or is there something deeper going on? I need to hit the RESET button. Any advice appreciated!

I wanted to chime in about two things real quick...
DE won't rid lice/mites and will not do a thing for worms.

Also..the feather fixer feed.
What brand do you buy?

 

[Shamo Hybrid]

I only had time to glance at it. I couldn't see what exactly they studied. There are lots of FDA approved drugs that turn out to be harmful. Anyone doing a study can choose how to do it, and they may not do it right. Even among homeopaths, there is disagreement on the "right" was to prescribe and to dose. Some people use the little pellets straight, some insist the pellet has to be dissolved in water. Some just don't know how to recognize symptoms and then can't possibly select the right remedy. I took one dog to 2 vets. They both had very good reputations in the holistic community, one was even nationally known. They each prescribed a different remedy for the dog and neither was helpful. It wasn't until a few years after that, when I really started to learn about homeopathy, that I realized those vets didn't really understand homeopathy and that was why they couldn't use it correctly. When I occasionally need to take one of my kids (11, 14, 16) to the doctor, the doctors are surprised to find out that the kids have never had antibiotics, ibuprofen, Tylenol, cough medicine, allergy medicine, etc. Several years ago, the doctor said 2 of them had ear infections and they needed antibiotics. I took them home, gave them a remedy, and about an hour later they were better. People can be affected by placebos (which all medicine can fall in that category), but animals can't. No study can convince me that what I have lived for the past 10+ years wasn't real.

So if I'm dying of a gunshot wound, you would concoct me some sort of secret herbal tea made from a rare plant only found deep inside the Amazonian jungles instead of taking me to the ER because you don't believe in all that medical studies mumbo jumbo that doctors spent years and years studying from which others from the past have as well through trial and error? But instead rely on some imaginative make-believe healing in which scientific studies have proven to be nothing more than some sort of placebo effect, sprinkled with some magical wishful thinking pixie dust? OK, I know who not to call if I'm ever bitten by a snake.