Do you think dogs/pets feel the emotion "jealousy"?

[justbugged]

Quote:
I agree. I think that animals are under valued by the idea that they don't have emotions. But I am one of those people that gets into arguments with my Komondor that I end up loosing fairly often. And then there is when I get cussed out by a really mad Silkie.

Silkies can swear.

 

[Mugen]

Cool, a Komondor owner in BYC. I have two males. Love them to death.


Quote:
I agree. I think that animals are under valued by the idea that they don't have emotions. But I am one of those people that gets into arguments with my Komondor that I end up loosing fairly often. And then there is when I get cussed out by a really mad Silkie.

Silkies can swear.

 

[chicksbestfriend]

Do you think dogs/pets feel the emotion "jealousy"?

This question makes for good debate, and these are my opinions on the matter based on my experience. From my experience in raising dogs/animals/pets, what have you, I have never really termed their behaviors as emotions. Though I have gone through many emotions myself while trying to asess and correct the animal with certain behaviors, I believe that the animal really doesnt feels emotions nor does he have any psychological or physical control over himself when certain situations arise. Like the lose of their constant companion. I dont think the dog "feels sad, depressed, heart broken over the loss", but is evident that there is an effect on the dog with its suppressed energy. I do believe there is some level of frustration that dogs experiences which reveals itself through anxiety, frustrations, or suppressed energy which the animal displays in so many different behaviors, we may not really recognize the cue the animal is sending us. The obsessive behaviors in animals, such as always wanting to be close to you, rubbed or pet, destroying furniture or toys, or a continueous bark, just some examples, these behaviors are a form of addiction, which actually blinds them and robs them from achieveing happiness, having fun or just being relaxed, you know, like a normal or balanced dog........ (By the way, what is normal and balanced?) Just as a human might have an addiction to alcohol because they desire to achieve a certain outcome with the effects, its the same with the animals and their obsessive behaviors, there is a certain effect they want to achieve. I have found by giving my dogs the proper amount of exercise everyday, releasing all that pent up energy inside of them, I am better able to enforce the limits of what behavior are and are not acceptable. The animals need to know that there are limits, and the limits are set by you. They need to be submissive.

I have one dog that use to experience separation anxiety everytime I would leave a room and even worse, when I would leave the property for any length of time. When I would returned, she began to realize, that if she continuously barked, wagged her tail, and become super hyped out, I would come and give her the attention that she craved, and she was right because she was now setting the limits for herself. She would eventually settle down, but the more I let her slide with her behaviors, the more dangerous it became for her. She then began gnawing on herself leaving big wounds on her legs, and the previous behaviors that she was displaying were intensifying and for longer durations at a time. I changed my approach. I had to set the limits as to what behavior was acceptable to me and for her. I began by not make eye contact with her, nor would I acknowledge the behavior. Eventually, she learned that she was not achieving the desired affects and became more submissive over time, and stopped displaying those behaviors. Today, I can walk into the house, pull up on the property and she will sit there patiently waiting for the attention, shows excitement to see me but she no longer experiences the separation axieties. The gnawing behavior has not resurfaced in over a year. What I have learned, it that dogs do wants limits, they want consistancy in their structure and to be submissive and pleasing to their master.

 

[QuailHollow]

Answer to the subject: NO

 

[geebs]

yes I do.... Why in the world wouldn't they. They have friends and relationship and losses. My horse mourned the loss of a herdmate. My dog is extremely jealous of the cat.... Just put another cat in your cat's territory and let the fur fly. They feel anger.... They feel territorial. They feel sick and premenstral.... Why wouldn't they feel anything else. Ignoring thier feelings is a way we can minimize their value and importance over our own. I think it is us as ppl that don't feel enough.

 

[aggieterpkatie]

Quote:
I think it's very easy to term behaviors to our own emotions because we are comfortable with the terms. Sometimes it is, for example, easiest to say "my dog is spiteful" because he or she chewed up the remote or a pair of underwear while you left for the day. Or "my dog is jealous" when pack structure is changed suddenly.

We all understand what jealousy feels like and looks like, we all understand spiteful feelings. Because a dog's behavior can seem jealous or spiteful doesn't mean that it is. WE are ONLY seeing the outward and most obvious signs of the problem. Most people are too unobservant to see the scenario as a whole.

I don't think that dogs get jealous as a normal emotion. I don't think dogs are spiteful. However...LOL I will say I have seen dogs, in certain situations, have reactions that I cannot explain other than with those good old familiar terms. I think that there are some dogs who may feel these things from time to time. Though I don't think it is normal or common.

Dogs are very uncomfortable, for the most part, with change in pack structure. A new dog in the house is usually more traumatic than a new human. Dogs, being individuals, will always react in some way. Sometimes dramatic behavior changes sometimes in ways we don't even see. Some dogs are naturally comfortable with their leadership and dont' take too much "offense" to a new dog in the house. While other, more insecure dogs, will take a huge notice and act out of character, more "needy" and controlling to the regular members of the pack.

Dogs will manipulate humans to get what they need. Does your dog need security? Yes, well he might start to act sickly or lethargic because in the past that has gotten him needed attention and therefore, control, over an uncomfortable time. Your dog might be reacting to you more or less friendly because they sometimes just try and get closer with their older pack members. Its easier to glom onto something familiar than to deal with something new.

I think that I take issue (not with the OP personally) with the idea of these feelings because in explaining away behavior with those terms we fail to really address the problem. Its easy to say "yeah my dog just chewed my remote because he was angry at me for leaving him" than to say "why did my dog do this and what can i do to make sure it doesn't happen again?". Making the dog take responsibility for the so-called emotion takes the responsibility off our shoulders. People do this with children to.

I agree totally!

 

[Brindlebtch]

Quote:
I agree, I'm just not sure about jealousy. In a pack situation, everyone wants positive reinforcement from the leader, but I don't know if the low animal not getting the attention, or food, or toy is actually "jealous" so much as just recognizing it's not getting what it wants because it's lower on the totem pole

. When the other dogs are around, I'm sure to pet and recognize them first. Solomon sits back and pretty much waits his turn. If he tries to horn in on the others, he gets a lifted lip and a little growl from whichever other dog is offended and he backs off.

Perhaps "frustrated" would be a better word for that paticular situation? He obviously wants attention but the others warn him off.

I have seen, many times, what I would call jealousy displayed between 2 dogs wanting attention from an owner.


Up until a several years ago behaviorists supported the theory of "if you give an animal such and such stimulation it will react in a particular way". Stimulate - react. No thought - it is hard wired. Then they discovered even creatures like octopuses have advanced problem solving capabilities. Now some of the scientific community are starting to come around to thinking most creatures think a lot more and have a wider range of emotions that we have given them credit for in the previous decades. If you read around, you can find instances of amazing and complex thought proceses being documented in all sorts of critters.

In my opinion the majority of the scientific community is sadly closed minded and do not readily accept a change in "established" theory or hypothesis. You might have to wait until the current generation of scientists retire before significant change in scientific views will be accepted as valid.

Just MHO.


edited for spellig

 

[Brindlebtch]

Quote:
I agree. I think that animals are under valued by the idea that they don't have emotions. But I am one of those people that gets into arguments with my Komondor that I end up loosing fairly often. And then there is when I get cussed out by a really mad Silkie.

Silkies can swear.

That's OK. Lots of folk lose arguments with Komondors!

You might need to man up about the silkie, though!

 

[BlackBart]

Quote:
I agree and we put them into human terms.

Now, I'm not very mushy about animals at all and am very practical when it comes to reading their behaviors as they relate to humans and our emotions.

Barring a better term with which to label these behaviors, I don't see anything wrong in saying that they display "jealousy" or " sadness". As we have no way of knowing what that behavior would be labelled in dog language, I would just call it by the word that would best describe that particular behavior, so as to better communicate it to other humans.

I have, on two separate occasions and two separate species, witnessed behavior that one could only label as "vindictive" or "malicious". There was simply no other explanation for these behaviors....so one has to use the word most likely to describe it.

I agree. Talk to any animal communicator and they will tell you that animals feel as many ranges of emotions as humans do, except one, animals don't lie.
If there was any doubt in my mind that animals can feel and it can be called a "feeling" in human terms, It was changed after reading the book "When Elephants Sleep".
Very profound collection of animal experiences from all walks of life and professions.

 

[CheepSunglasses]

Actually, it's not as debatable a question as it used to be. According to a recent study by the National Academy of Sciences, they do. This will come as no surprise whatsoever to most dog owners.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=97944783