Dog / Human Conflict

[McChooky]

I hope this doesn't escalate! Is putting up an electric fence an option? Best of luck to you!

 

[centrarchid]

your initial post was clear but your last few have been less so

the neighbor saw you posting “no trespassing” signs and contacted you via text to tell you his dogs aren’t trespassing?

i’ll advise again not to engage with your neighbor, but to hire an attorney to do the fighting for you. it’s their job and they’re better at it than you are. if you want the problem handled, it’s likely your quickest path to a resolution.

I do not think he saw me put signs up. Rather, the signs makes so my position on trespassing is clear for legal reasons and that he can no longer say I have not been clear about it.

Our laws on these issues are simple, I think I can handle it.

 

[centrarchid]

I had a neighbor, A, who owned sheep. He lived about half a mile north of me. Neighbor B's dog got out and ran those sheep one day. Neighbor A walked down and knocked on B's door and accused the dog, who by this time had come home. A had his shotgun with him. I was gardening at the time. B shrugged and said, "Do what you gotta do," and A shot the dog, turned around and walked back home. End of story. I was shocked, of course, but that was the end of it.

That approach we cannot legally do in Missouri. Dogs must be in the act and on property where stock are supposed to be before direct immediate action can be taken against dog. I met all those criteria plus provided ample documented warnings.

 

[centrarchid]

Revenge tends to cause problems, as people reciprocate back and forth. And killing the dog will not bring those birds back to life. So no, I do not think there is any right to revenge.

But since some birds were still alive, shooting the dog can help protect them. And the birds that were loose are not the only birds OP has. There are other birds in pens, and other birds that OP may want to let loose in future-- so there are a large number of birds that can be protected by removing the dog that is already proven to kill chickens. (Well, the other dogs need to get removed or confined too, but if shooting one will cause the owner to confine them all, then that is also successful in protecting the chickens.)

So I think the shooting was sensible, but only when viewed as protecting living chickens, not as revenge.

I need to keep that in my head as I waffle over my actions.

 

[centrarchid]

I hope this doesn't escalate! Is putting up an electric fence an option? Best of luck to you!

I use electrical fencing, but using it to keep dogs off entire property would be prohibitive. Acreage is nearly 20 acres and far from ideal square. All fencing effort is currently for protecting the actual barn area. The dogs will still be able to go everywhere else which brings them into conflict with my dogs tasked with defending barn and poultry in yard around house. The activity of neighbor's dogs on my property degrades what I can do on my own property with respect to animals. At some point I will be running sheep and goats and they will not always be in the fencing that is currently almost 6 feet tall and designed to work without hotwire. This current fencing install is a lot pricier than typical for sheep and goat pasture. Those dogs cannot be allowed to impose higher fencing cost as I try to take advantage of more pasture I own.

 

[BigBlueHen53]

Revenge tends to cause problems, as people reciprocate back and forth. And killing the dog will not bring those birds back to life. So no, I do not think there is any right to revenge.

But since some birds were still alive, shooting the dog can help protect them. And the birds that were loose are not the only birds OP has. There are other birds in pens, and other birds that OP may want to let loose in future-- so there are a large number of birds that can be protected by removing the dog that is already proven to kill chickens. (Well, the other dogs need to get removed or confined too, but if shooting one will cause the owner to confine them all, then that is also successful in protecting the chickens.)

So I think the shooting was sensible, but only when viewed as protecting living chickens, not as revenge.

It was the neighbor who attributed "revenge" as a motive. Using deadly force to prevent a predator from inflicting further damage on one's livestock, when it has already caused the death of some, seems like a reasonable course of action, and I daresay the majority of chicken keepers have done so or would if necessary. Whether the dog's owner learns anything from it or changes the way he controls his dogs in the future, it will certainly prevent that particular animal from committing a second offense.

 

[aart]

Backstory starting in this post:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/english-shepherd-as-poultry-guardian.1008645/post-25065352

 

[centrarchid]

Everything starts with post #1130 on September 24. I did not realize it went that far back in time.

 

[DickMidnight]

Our laws on these issues are simple, I think I can handle it.

Everything starts with post #1130 on September 24. I did not realize it went that far back in time.

if it’s been going on for two months i think the issue is a little above your pay grade.

i’m not sure why people are so resistant to retain a lawyer.

 

[centrarchid]

if it’s been going on for two months i think the issue is a little above your pay grade.

i’m not sure why people are so resistant to retain a lawyer.

I might be well versed in legal statutes at play.