Feeding Organic rations to Quail...a "complete" diet is needed

[EllyHood]

I'm getting my first group of breeding quail next week and the guy I'm getting them from currently feeds them Durmor (sorry if I've spelled that wrong) chick starter which is 24% protein. My chickens get countryside organics feed which is certified organic, GMO-free, and soy-free. The protein is from fish meal. So, I have a few questions...
Can I feed quail fermented feed? My chickens love it but I don't know if it's ok for quail.
Is suet an appropriate supplement for quail? I have access to grass fed organic suet and I'm assuming it's high in protein?
Is sprouted barley fodder ok for quail?
Has anyone fed quail duckweed? The lemna variety is up to 45% protein.
Is organic cat food an ok supplement and if so, would it be reasonable to feed them countryside organics chick starter (21% protein) and add organic cat food to bump up the protein?

 

[Sill]

Yes to fermented feed having higher B vitamin content, as well as upping the protein content as the grains in the feed are soaked.

My local organic co-op offers 26% protein turkey starter that I will be ordering at the next shipment. I only recently obtained quail so am new to feeding them. I had to argue with my LFS owner about quail not being OK with lower protein foods. He insisted that the 20% stuff he had was fine when I know they started picking on each other when I ran out of the higher protein feed I had been feeding. In the meantime I've ground dog food to up the protein of their feed when my meal worm and black soldier fly cultures have not kept up with demand. I've ordered some 24% turkey starter that is conventional from my LFS but at least it is not medicated.

My problem here is finding higher protein feed that is not medicated! How long do you have to wait anyway until the medicated feed would be out of their system so their eggs and meat is safe to eat??

I can't wait for my organic co-op order to comes in! Here are the ingredients for the 26% organic turkey starter. Let me know what you think. I will be supplementing with mealworms and BSFs in addition to the dry feed and fermented feed.

 

[AClassicalLife]

Hi Tanya.Thank you for writing.
I've got a place in Telluride. We're practically neighbors. Actually- we are neighbors since everything is seven hours away in every direction except Durango and Montrose.
The issue with organic is that the FDA does not allow any livestock nutrition product that includes fish meal to not include specific preservatives and these are not organic.
We've grappled with this problem for years as most of our client base are natural food folks and local foodivores. I've got some work in front of me and will return to this afterward.
In the short term, look into organic unhulled sesame, organic quinoa, organic millet: Golden Organic, Golden Prairie they're both Colorado have both. Teff seed from the Teff company in Iowa is another very important material. Cooked wild rice/brown rice mixture is another. I'll be back with the amino acid profiles required for Coturnix and how to arrive at the base needed for egg and also meat.

My favorite Coturnix of all time is the Harlequin! Pets only but such personalities!

I know I'm responding to a very old thread so please forgive me. I'm interested in the subject OP and the poster I'm quoting have brought up.

Locally, I've found nothing but 20.5% protein chick starter/turkey starter that is USDA Organic and Non-GMO Project Verified. It is also soy and corn free, which I like. I can supplement worms from a vermiculture bin, but only so many at a time so they can continue to breed. They would have access to other bugs as well. I've been looking into triticale since I have an organic source for that. It's very high in protein - 21%. I'm just not sure how much to add... Einkorn is also another possibility, but not quite as high in protein. I'm aware some people say 18%-27% is enough protein, and others 32%... I've heard of people using 20.5% without issues but I want to make sure I provide enough and I see such a range of differing opinions on how much protein is enough protein, so I'd like to play it safe and, if possible, add to the aforementioned feed to bump the protein up to a safe level. I cannot add very much, if any, fishmeal. It would barely raise the protein at all when I inquired, and it would be very cost-prohibitive. So I am just researching my options right now.

 

[Fat Daddy]

I was around and knew Tonya well back then. She worked long and hard on this project. It continued even after what was documented here. Protein content of soy meal is 45 to 48%. Fish meal is around 65%. If I remember right. Tonya's feed program/experiment eventually ended up using bone meal. It runs right at 50% crude protein. I do remember it being a lot more expensive for her to keep her feed soy-GMO free. Infact she ended up running both. GMO free and then cheaper eggs that were raised on normal feed. Meal worms are one of the most expensive, Labor intensive form of protein you can use. If I were set on going soy/corn/GMO free. And could find a commercial feed that was 21% protein. That I could afford. This is the path I would walk. Once you start custom mixing your own feed on a hobby level. It opens up a whole new set of challenges that can take the enjoyment straight out of keeping the birds. When it becomes like a second job, I start think'n about fish'n more! I hope you find a way that works for you. Good luck either way...

 

[La Condessa]

I was around and knew Tonya well back then. She worked long and hard on this project. It continued even after what was documented here. Protein content of soy meal is 45 to 48%. Fish meal is around 65%. If I remember right. Tonya's feed program/experiment eventually ended up using bone meal. It runs right at 50% crude protein. I do remember it being a lot more expensive for her to keep her feed soy-GMO free. Infact she ended up running both. GMO free and then cheaper eggs that were raised on normal feed. Meal worms are one of the most expensive, Labor intensive form of protein you can use. If I were set on going soy/corn/GMO free. And could find a commercial feed that was 21% protein. That I could afford. This is the path I would walk. Once you start custom mixing your own feed on a hobby level. It opens up a whole new set of challenges that can take the enjoyment straight out of keeping the birds. When it becomes like a second job, I start think'n about fish'n more! I hope you find a way that works for you. Good luck either way...

And bone meal worked well for her? It didn't raise the calcium levels too high for the roos?

I would love to be able to go organic/non-gimp with my birds.

 

[AClassicalLife]

You would go ahead with 21%? 20.5% is the highest I can find here, I hope that's acceptable at least as a "base". I could order the Phoenix feed mentioned here or another brand that's USDA Organic, that would likely entail shipping fees (which might be too high, Phoenix's were reasonable if you buy enough, I can freeze some) but the other brand is a little better IMPO. The ease of it being pre-formulated is definitely very helpful. I'd rather not make all of their feed, but if I could add anything to it (like one or two grains) to bump up the protein that would definitely be doable, I just don't know how much to add. Hmmm. Thanks !

 

[AClassicalLife]

For those of you trying to raise your quail organically, can you please drop Scratch and Peck an email to let them know there is a market for Corn and Soy free Organic game bird feed? I know a few have already, but more is better.

Thank you, Julie

As luck would have it, I sent a few e-mails back and forth with their CSR, oh, a month+ ago? The challenge is the protein source in order to stay USDA Organic. That's something I don't fully understand as I see other brands of feed (not corn or soy free, though) with higher protein. They recommended feeding the 20.5% protein chick starter, and adding extra fish meal if necessary, but told me they have people raising quail on this feed with no problems, if that means anything to anybody. Their turkey starter is the same protein ratio.

 

[Camp Julsby]

I am currently using S&P Starter I do add fishmeal as suggested. I also add oyster shell and scrambled eggs. My quail get extra frozen defrosted meal worms with an organic greens salad each day. It would be nice to have an all in one feed without having to doctor it up for those higher protien levels. Also it has come to my attention that there are rumors they won't be offering fish meal much longer.

 

[AClassicalLife]

They didn't really say I had to add fishmeal, they just said if I was concerned I *could*, but the people that use the chick starter for quail from them as-is do just fine, if that helps at all...

I really hope S&P doesn't stop carrying fishmeal though... :/ Theirs is the best I've found. I was thinking of offering it free-choice instead of mixing it in (as it's so pricey).

 

[Born2blove]

Can I feed my Coturnix Quail with these

http://www.phoenixorganicfeed.com/u..._tempe_gilbert_chandler_glendale_peoria_b.pdf

26% Organic Turkey Starter - 50lb bag - $33.50