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I'm sorry you and your family had such a sad experience with this hatchery. If you don't mind though...I'd like to share with you what our (my husband's and myself) experience with his chicks have been over the past three days - it's a bit odd.Our Heartland Hatchery story:
First a couple things about the other posts. All their ads that we have seen do say to call not Email so I won't hold the not answering Emails against him. With the phone calls, more often then not when we have called we have gotten his answering machine but whether we left a message or not he has always called us back and usually within the hour. We have also recieved calls to ask us about interest in surplus chicks he has had. One thing I did notice was that most of the posters that have had positive experiences with them look like they joined made that one post and none since. Makes me wonder.
Back to our experience. We were looking for a few certain breeds and came across Heartland Hatcheries ads for their chick days. He didn't have but one breed that we were looking for at the time but did have some other breeds that we were considering so we contacted Allen. He was very polite took all the time in the world and we discussed availability and future locations that he would be at. He was to be in our area about a month from our first contact. We talked a few times before the big day came and headed to the feed store that morning with excitement of which breeds he would have.
When we got there we were like kids in a candy store. Cute little chicks all lined up in boxes and they were hopping from box to box. He went through what all of them was and My wife, daughter and I all discussed what to get. Of course we wanted some of just about everything but where limited on what we could afford. The amount added up quickly and of course we spent more than we would of liked but we all got a few of the breeds we wanted.
We got 20 chicks, and 5 guineas. They were happy healthy little chicks and off we went. We had every thing ready for them. Newly built brooder boxes in our spare bedroom. Lights with dimmer switches, waters, feeders, everything.
All went well and about a week later we hatch some eggs and had more baby chicks. At about that time the guineas were outgrowing everyone and the two banty breeds were begaining to be quite a bit smaller. Then my first mistake .... missing chicks. We split our hatch into two groups. one group being a breed that we had really wanted and spent quite a bit for the eggs. They were all gonna be keepers. The second group was gonna be some that we were gonna let some go out of. We split the chicks from Allen into three groups, Guineas, bigger chicks and banties. we then but the banties with our group of keepers as they were a bit younger and about the same size as the banties.
Within three days things started going bad and it was all but over within 3 or 4 days. We lost 1 out of 5 guineas. 9 out of 12 of the bigger chicks from Heartland and all 8 of the banties. We also lost 8 out of 10 of our hatch that was with the banties. But none of the others from our hatch.
It was horrible for my wife and daughter as I carried out one dead chick after another day after day and really sad as the three that lived were all from my picks. BTW those three were supposed to be pullets and as of now one or two are cockerels.
I am usually not one to complain and understand things happen. A coupl of days ago I saw Heartlands ad back up that they were coming back to where we had purchased our chicks. At this time my wife had given up on ever buying chicks again from anywhere period. I decided to call Allen and ask if anyone else had reported any issues or if he had any idea what happened. He seemed to be very helpful and we went over many possibilities with no answers. Looking back now I see that he was steering the cause to something we did wrong (mainly mixing the chicks which wasnt smart on my part but lession learned) or just one of those things that happen.
He offered to "work something out" which I knew he didn't owe us anything as that is the risk with any living things and we knew that risk ahead of time but for a moment I had the idea that maybe we could end up with some new chicks of at least the breeds that my wife and daughter lost. And it would restore her faith in buying chicks and all would be good. He offered to get ahold of me after he was done at both locations for that Saturday and see what surplus chicks he had and I could get any of them for half price. He mentioned some of the breeds he usually has left and all were common egg layers. The breeds we had got before were banty and some of the more uncommon breeds. I mentioned that I wasnt looking for the breeds he mentioned and told him what the chicks were that we lost. He mentioned that those were the ones that he would have the least of and said I'll let you know what I end up with at the end of the day. I mentioned that I was close to the morning location and asked if I could come out first thing and pick some then and only the breeds we had lost and no more then what we had lost. He went back to the we'll see what I have left at the end of the day and that he would be coming closer to were we lived on his way home and we could meet in the next town over. He was to contact me at 3:00 Saturday.
Well 3:00 came and went and no call. I called him at about 3:45 and he said he had forgot to check for me but was stopping to deliever some to a gentleman in about 5 or 10 minutes that he would check and get back with me. That was the last time I talked to Allen and tried a couple of more times and left a message.
As I sat at home and browsed CL I saw a Heartland Hatchery ad. It said that in the last hour of his day at the second location that with a minimum purchase of 40 chicks that you could have them for half price. So his offer to us was the same offer as he had advertised to everyone except he dropped the minimum amount.
As I reflect on my day and the conversations we have had the last few days I am seeing it for what it is. We had a bad experience with this hatcheries chicks and he had gotten my hopes up by offering me a deal that he pretty much offered anyone else and in the end didnt even give us a chance to purchase any new chicks from him. He had wanted to make me think we had done something wrong in raising the chicks or it was some mysterious airborn illness or just some freak thing that happens. What I cant quite get past is the fact that we lost 17 out of 20 .of the chicks from him and 8 out of 10 of the ones we hatched that were with the ones from him but have lost zero of the ones we hatch that were not in contact with the ones from him.They were all raised the same. feed the same, watered as often, in the same room, exposed to the same things, etc etc.
I do not know what went wrong but that is our story for what it is worth.
As for the chcks we lost, They would start as lethargic then head turning, twitching, troubles walking, stubbling, falling over and trouble getting back up then with the ones I saw leg twitching and death. Most died within the same day as the issues started, And the three that lived look like their growth and feathering was stunted. Our week younger chicks and a few others that were two and a half weeks younger (which we have not lost any of either) have all out grown and out feathered them.
Cluckycharms,
Thank you and glad you posted your story. When I said "makes me wonder" I was referring that I was a little sceptical about the posts that looked as tho they signed up just to post a positive post about this hatchery and then was never active here again.
I was not telling anyone not to purchase from this hatchery as I said I was about to purchase from them again after our experience. I too was hesitant to post because I guess I was raised with the "if you cant say something nice about someone then dont say anything at all" way of thinking. I decided to go ahead and tell my story and people can take it for what it is worth to them.
Although the loss of almost all of the chicks was painful for my family I can understand. They are living creatures and IMO chicks are fragile. I am just getting back into them but have raised chickens for probably 15 years or more including hundreds and hundreds of chicks in the past. I guess my issue is more about how differently I was treated after my contact with Allen and telling him about what happened. Before hand not only had I contacted him he had contacted me on three or four occasions asking if I was interested in buying such and such breeds that he had at the time or telling me what breeds he would have the next chick day. When it was about me putting money in his pocket it was all good but once there was a hint that I might not be putting anymore in then it wasnt even worth his time to answer his phone. Maybe he has a point, why waste time if it doesnt end up profiting him? I was also raised with the understanding that "it isn't always about money" or at least it shouldnt always be. So I can not support this hatchery and will share my story anytime I can and let others decide if they want to or not.
Glad all is well with your little ones and hope they continue to thrive and we will also hope that anyone else's chicks from Heartland live a long happy life. Our chicks did great until about day 10 or so then had no more deaths after about day 14 or so although I dont think they are growing at the rate they should.
I'm not sure what you mean by he breeds them naturally?.... he has healthy chickens and breeds them naturally ....
I'm not sure what you mean by he breeds them naturally?
I can think of a couple of possibilities:
1. You mean he lets the roosters mate with the hens rather than performing Artificial Insemination. If that was what you meant, I can't think that would make any difference in the health of the chicks.
2. You mean he lets broody hens incubate the eggs rather than hatching in an incubator. If that was what you meant, I would be stunned to learn that is the case. Waiting for a hen to go broody and then being limited to the number of eggs she can hatch in one setting, would vastly limit the number of chicks he can produce. The only way to produce enough chicks to be considered a "hatchery" is to incubate them. One incubated egg/chick is the same as another - there is nothing "natural" about it.
Regardless, I am glad your chicks are now doing better. My guess would be that your thermometer is not accurate, and was reading too high. When you lowered the temperature "12 degrees" you were actually lowering it to the 90 or so that they are happiest at, at that age.
I actually do not keep a thermometer under my chicks, but adjust the temperature according to their behavior. If they are huddled under it, they are cold an I need to turn it up. If they stay on the perimeter of the light, rarely venturing under it, it is too hot and I need to turn it down. If they are spread out, happily running around spending some of their time under the heat and some of it at the opposite end of the brooder eating and drinking, the temperature is just about right. Rather than raise and lower a lamp to achieve this, I just plug it into a lamp dimmer. That way the turn of a switch makes the adjustment I need.
I hope I didn't sound argumentative - I didn't mean to - I really was just interested to know what you meant. For the record, I really kind of agree with you. I don't handle mine with kid gloves either and they seem to do just fine. In the past couple of months I've hatched two small batches from my own eggs. The first were outside full-time at 2 1/2 weeks, since the weather here was pretty mild. The second batch, even though it was a month later in the year, were outside full-time at only 12 days old. By outside, I mean they spend their days truly outside, in a chick run that is covered by a tarp, and at night I carry them into the coop where they have a "nursery" area to sleep. They were 3 weeks old yesterday, and I woke up to see the ground covered in frost, and the thermometer reading only 29 degrees. I'll admit my heart skipped a beat thinking of those 15 three-week-olds out there in the coop, but they were fine when I went to check on them. In the coop they have straw to bed down in and no drafts, and the 15 warm bodies huddled together seemed to keep them warm enough. I know many people who swear they have to be under a heat lamp until they are six-weeks-old but I've never had any chicks under a lamp past four weeks, and those were chicks I hatched in January. I do think acclimation is key though. If I had taken those three-week-olds out from under a heat lamp and thrown them in the coop and it was 29 degrees, I'm sure they would have perished. It was because they had a week and a half to acclimate to the changing night/day temps, that the drop in the temperature didn't seem to faze them.I had three different thermometers in their brooder (three different brands) two were mercury and 1 was digital. Digital registers at 83.5 and mercury register at 83.7. I assure you, there's nothing wrong with the thermometers. However, I have since pulled all three of them out of there...as my chicks are doing a really good job of telling me when they're too hot/too cold, so I'm going by their actions and behavior instead of a reading on a thermometer (like you do). Mine are fine at 83.5 (accurate reading). I didn't know about lamp dimmers - but I will definitely look into that, because pretty soon we're going to be at the ceiling raising that lamp. LOL Thank you! Home Depot or Lowes would have one maybe? PetCo? Tractor Supply?
In regard to natural breeding, I used the wrong word, I think. What I said was: "I really believe with everything that I have witnessed in the last three days from our four - that he has healthy chickens and breeds them naturally and doesn't carry them round with kid gloves." Perhaps "breeding" wasn't the appropriate word to use in that sentence. As stated, I'm quite sick with a nasty flu and had recently taken meds. lol What that sentence was supposed to mean is that I believe he isn't too cautious about keeping them at 95 all the time or in a brooder 24/7, treating them with kid gloves. (they were all in cardboard boxes on an overcast day for 3 hours in several different towns over the weekend...one of which was outdoors). I think he just lets them be chicks...and acclimate themselves to whatever environment they are in naturally. There are several different vids I've seen of mother hens out in fairly chilly air with their baby chicks and the chicks were fine (and not under her wing). I think rearing or raising was probably the better word that I should have used, as I wasn't referring to the actual act of breeding.