Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[Lacy Blues]

The Sussex is always said to have a flat level back. Thus measuring the angle of the tail in a Sussex from the angle of the back. Anyway, a bird's tail is connected to its body, not the ground. If one is measuring tail angle to help determine symmetry in the bird, why would one use a measurement that is not intrinsic to the bird? i.e. the ground on which it stands. Using the ground as a measuring tool may help to create symmetry in a landscape but not within the bird itself.
Karen

I am only repeating what the standard says. I imagine it would be difficult and take more pages and whatnot to address each bird by the angle of its back and then compute the angle of the tail. Not all birds are flat backed, many of them have varying degrees of sloping. Again, it's not my determination but rather that of the standard that says it is measured from horizontal.

 

[Arielle]

Quote:
I always look at the ground to see how the slop is affecting stance. THen look at the bird. Each component effects the angles. As far as the angle of the back in relation to the tail, I would think this is a very important relationship. One effects the other; or at least certainly the back effects the tail. I tossed out oats and watched for a while. Have picked a couple to cull.

 

[Lacy Blues]

Quote:

Lacy, here's a handy site that tells the relative merits to all kinds of feed ingredients: http://ingredients101.com/brsgrnd.htm The page it opens on is the one on brewer's grains...which are as close to the fermented grain information as I could get for protein percentages. Distiller's grains are similar.

Just look to the menu on the right side of the page to find details on a huge list of ingredients.

Thank you for the link Bee.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: A new store just opened about 20minutes away--

 

[Beekissed]

Quote:
I bought mine at my local feed store, where they usually carry any mix of pasture seeds one would want and also the individual types of seeds as well. I used to mix in some crimson clover but found it grew too high and soon enough the WDC would crowd it out anyway. WDC has many jobs at our place...it attracts pollinators to the garden, fixes nitrogen in the soil, provides ground cover for tilled soil to keep soil from eroding and to keep moisture there, as habitat for bugs and beneficial bacteria and also to feed the chickens and deer~both being our meat source. We keep WDC in the garden paths between the rows to keep weeds from growing there and for clean footing in the garden and also around the base of our fruit trees.

A good time to seed your lawn is in the winter time...the snow acts like a fertilizer and has many minerals in it that rain does not have. I used to seed mine right on top of the snow. It's one of the earliest and quickest to germinate and so can get established before some of the native grasses can take over.

Here's a pic or two of some of the meat birds grazing the clover and also my layer birds. Everywhere I move that I intend to have free ranging flocks, I overseed the orchards and yard/pasture with some WDC and also do some pelleted lime along with it, as the soils here tend to be more acidic and the WDC likes a balanced pH. I also like to plant tall fescue(22% crude protein) at the same time, so that when the nutrition in the WDC declines somewhat at the end of summer, the tall fescue is coming into its highest level of sugar and, man, you never saw livestock fatten like you've seen them fatten up on tall fescue. My sheep would be rolling with fat on that graze(the sheep were all grass fed only) and the chickens as well.

 

[Fred's Hens]

From The Moderation Team​

When Robert "Bob" Blosl started this thread a few years back his intent was clear. This thread is about birds bred to the Standard, (the Standard of Perfection of the American Poultry Association) so-called "heritage" birds. Large Fowl. Whenever this thread went down a bunny trail, Bob would always bring it back to its focus with his own, unique, folksy style enticing people, drawing people and encouraging people toward the procuring, raising, breeding and sharing of these great birds with others so they too might know the joy of Standard bred birds of great heritage.

Sadly, Bob is gone from us. We do well to honor his immense contribution and rich legacy by staying true to Bob's purpose for this thread. BYC has a forum and threads in those forums for every other imaginable topic. Here's just a few with links provided.

Coop & Run - Design, Construction, & Maintenance
Feeding & Watering Your Flock
Emergencies / Diseases / Injuries and Cures
Predators and Pests
Managing Your Flock

So, if there is a desire to discuss coop construction? Good news, as there's a forum for that. Same with feeding, diseases, pests, and all the rest of the somewhat related topics. But, once mentioned, the all too likely tendency is to begin a side track conversation that takes this thread off topic for pages and pages. It is the consensus of the administration and moderators that this is potentially harmful to the thread. Yes, all these various topics are involved when keeping Standard bred birds, but we ask everyone to be extremely sensitive to the primary focus of this thread. Thank you one and all for your fine contribution to making this one of the best and longest running educational threads on BYC.

 

[BGMatt]

This bird belongs to one of Bob's friends, Jim Volk, and as the picture is labeled went Reserve Large Fowl at the WFF show last weekend. Not the best photo to evaluate but thought it was appropriate to share it anyway.

 

[Beekissed]

I agree! And I offer sincere apologies for my part in derailing this thread. Please forgive me, one and all, and please help me remember the purpose of the thread when I do participate. I won't mind a reminder at all, as I'm getting a little old in the head and could use the help.

Thank you, Fred, and the mod team, for preserving the integrity of this useful and educational thread!

 

[3riverschick]

Ok, the thread is cleansed of off topic conversations and we are back on track. Maybe the first thing we need to do is remind the thread
of Bob's original purpose in this thread. To that end, here is post number one from our beloved founder and BYC Educator, Bob Blosl:

I just got an email from a person who needs Barred Rock Large Fowl females who has large fowl Cockerels. She also wants the old fashion Rhode Island Red Large Fowl and wants me to help her find a good true to breed line. It made me think how many people out there have or breed old fashion Heritage Large Fowl Chickens?

When I was a little boy growing up in South West Washington State my dad use to take us on drives every Sunday in the country. As we drove by these old farms there were signs outside these farmers fences that would show Registered Polled Herefords, Black Angus, Brown Swiss, Jersey, Holstein and Shorthorn Cattle to just name a few. When I would go to the sale barns I never saw these kinds of cattle just the normal mix match type of cattle or half Guernsey half Herford type caves.

What do you think is a Heritage Style of Poultry like the above cattle breeds I mentioned?

Do any of you have any of these rare breeds?

How many Heat age Large Fowl do you think are left in the Country during the winter months in the breeding Pens? 100 -200- 300 birds per old rare breed?

What has happen to the folks like Grand Ma who use to have a flock of nice Heritage Chickens in the 1950s?

Do you think many want to preserve these old rare breeds?

These are just a few ideas I had today as I was feeding my chickens and after I got this email from one of the members of this board. Look forward to your replies and pictures of old birds. One breed that has made major strides in the past ten years is the Buckeye folks. It proves what they have done in the past five years can be done with any old rare breed.
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For those unaware of the definition of "Heritage Fowl ", here is post number four by Chris09, a BYC Flock Master and BYC Educator:
Hello Bob,
Good to see you here again.
Quote:
I feel the same as Matt Lhamon on this term and it is getting to be a new marketing term to get people to raise some of the old breeds. Here is the ALBC "Definition of a Heritage Chicken" -
Definition:
Heritage Chicken must adhere to all the following:
1. APA Standard Breed. Heritage Chicken must be from parent and grandparent stock of breeds recognized by the American Poultry Association (APA) prior to the mid-20th century; whose genetic line can be traced back multiple generations; and with traits that meet the APA Standard of Perfection guidelines for the breed. Heritage Chicken must be produced and sired by an APA Standard breed. Heritage eggs must be laid by an APA Standard breed.
2. Naturally mating. Heritage Chicken must be reproduced and genetically maintained through natural mating. Chickens marketed as Heritage must be the result of naturally mating pairs of both grandparent and parent stock.
3. Long, productive outdoor lifespan. Heritage Chicken must have the genetic ability to live a long, vigorous life and thrive in the rigors of pasture-based, outdoor production systems. Breeding hens should be productive for 5-7 years and roosters for 3-5 years.
4. Slow growth rate. Heritage Chicken must have a moderate to slow rate of growth, reaching appropriate market weight for the breed in no less than 16 weeks. This gives the chicken time to develop strong skeletal structure and healthy organs prior to building muscle mass.
Chickens marketed as Heritage must include the variety and breed name on the label.
Terms like heirloom, antique, old-fashioned, and old timey imply Heritage and are understood to be synonymous with the definition provided here.
Abbreviated Definition: A Heritage Egg can only be produced by an American Poultry Association Standard breed. A Heritage Chicken is hatched from a heritage egg sired by an American Poultry Association Standard breed established prior to the mid-20th century, is slow growing, naturally mated with a long productive outdoor life.
The American Livestock Breeds Conservancy has over 30 years of experience, knowledge, and understanding of endangered breeds, genetic conservation, and breeder networks.
Endorsed by the following individuals:
Frank Reese, Reese Turkeys, Good Shepherd Turkey Ranch, Standard Bred Poultry Institute, and American Poultry Association;
Marjorie Bender, Research & Technical Program Director, American Livestock Breeds Conservancy
D. Phillip Sponenberg, DVM, PhD., Technical Advisor, American Livestock Breeds Conservancy, and Professor, Veterinary Pathology and Genetics, Virginia Tech;
Don Bixby, DVM. Independent Consultant, former Executive Director for the American Livestock Breeds Conservancy;
R. Scott Beyer, PhD, Associate Professor, Poultry Nutrition Management, Kansas State University,
Danny Williamson, Windmill Farm, Good Shepherd Turkey Ranch, and American Poultry Association;
Anne Fanatico, PhD, Research Associate, Center for Excellence for Poultry Science, University of Arkansas;
Kenneth E. Anderson, Professor, Poultry Extension Specialist, North Carolina State University.

Do any of you have any of these rare breeds?

Rhode Island Reds and Dominiques

Chris​

Edited by Chris09 - 9/19/10 at 4:50pm
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If you are new to this thread, I welcome you and encourage you to read the first 5 pages.
They are very instructive of the thread's purpose. Thanks for coming! If you are seeking a
breed of Heritage Large Fowl which are bred to the SOP, please ask. Many veteran breeders
and knowledgeable folk here on this thread willing to help you get started in quality Heritage
SOP Large fowl.
Karen

 

[Fred's Hens]

This bird belongs to one of Bob's friends, Jim Volk, and as the picture is labeled went Reserve Large Fowl at the WFF show last weekend. Not the best photo to evaluate but thought it was appropriate to share it anyway.

There is NO doubt, in my mind, that Jim Volk has terrific birds. Gosh. Just something. Maybe it was Bob or maybe it was Ken Weaver, but anyhow, I believe Jim Volk and Bob Blosl could trace their primary stock back to similar sources, perhaps even to Wisconsin and the famous Halbach family. In any case, great job, Jim!!!
I am such a sucker for true bred White Rocks, as most folks here know.