Laying potential of hybrids?

[MustangCreekBunsnChicks]

I have hens/pullets of several breeds (Hamps, Wyandotte, a rock, an Ameraucana, and sex links). Our rooster is a silkie. If they were to produce offspring, what is the likelihood that the hens genetic aptitude for laying will offset the lower production of the silkie? Is it something that you don't know until you try it? Would it be better off to just replace the hens when they pass away or retire? I'm interested to see what you all think about this.

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Generally in the mix, the smaller and less productive bird drags down the larger one genetically in the offspring, but the results are not always linear.

I have a bantam Cochin hen crossed with a Barnevelder rooster as I wanted to size up my brooding hens. Bantam Cochin Momma is very prone to brooding. I was expecting about a mid size.

However, that female chick is surpassing my expectations size wise. So it can vary as to the size you get. I've had other mixes that were more of a middle ground.

As to laying, it depends on the Silkie line. I've had Silkies that didn't lay well at all, even when they weren't constantly brooding, but I had one gal that almost kept up with my production layers.

And that's another factor you will be folding into your line...broodiness. Silkies are known for excessively brooding. Brooding is not laying, so it is likely your eggs will be smaller and your productivity will go down as the daughters want to brood a lot.

You will also be adding foot feathers. In rainy weather, that can be a magnet for bumble foot. The first generation will be less feather than the Silkie, but breed backs will regain his genetics, so each generation will get smaller, less productive, and foot feathered.

If you want to refresh the flock with productivity and sustainability, I personally would not use a Silkie rooster. I would choose something from the Wyandotte or Hamp (New Hampshire??? really good choice as they are generally nice boys) or even the Ameraucana/Easter Egger, though if not fully Ameraucana, you have mixed results as the EE is already a mixed breed.

I've done quite well with my Barnevelder boy. Each generation breedback has taken on his calm characteristics, and amazingly, by F1 (1st) and definitely by F2 I've had hens with really nice double lacing and nicely terra cotta eggs.

So...yes...choose your rooster carefully for the goals which you wish to promote over time.

LofMc

 

[MustangCreekBunsnChicks]

Generally in the mix, the smaller and less productive bird drags down the larger one genetically in the offspring, but the results are not always linear.

I have a bantam Cochin hen crossed with a Barnevelder rooster as I wanted to size up my brooding hens. Bantam Cochin Momma is very prone to brooding. I was expecting about a mid size.

However, that female chick is surpassing my expectations size wise. So it can vary as to the size you get. I've had other mixes that were more of a middle ground.

As to laying, it depends on the Silkie line. I've had Silkies that didn't lay well at all, even when they weren't constantly brooding, but I had one gal that almost kept up with my production layers.

And that's another factor you will be folding into your line...broodiness. Silkies are known for excessively brooding. Brooding is not laying, so it is likely your eggs will be smaller and your productivity will go down as the daughters want to brood a lot.

You will also be adding foot feathers. In rainy weather, that can be a magnet for bumble foot. The first generation will be less feather than the Silkie, but breed backs will regain his genetics, so each generation will get smaller, less productive, and foot feathered.

If you want to refresh the flock with productivity and sustainability, I personally would not use a Silkie rooster. I would choose something from the Wyandotte or Hamp (New Hampshire??? really good choice as they are generally nice boys) or even the Ameraucana/Easter Egger, though if not fully Ameraucana, you have mixed results as the EE is already a mixed breed.

I've done quite well with my Barnevelder boy. Each generation breedback has taken on his calm characteristics, and amazingly, by F1 (1st) and definitely by F2 I've had hens with really nice double lacing and nicely terra cotta eggs.

So...yes...choose your rooster carefully for the goals which you wish to promote over time.

LofMc

We were given the little silkie by a friend. Quite a few of her hens have raised clutches I consider large for a small breed (4 or 5 babies). There's more breeders near by. I'll have to find out what breeds they keep.
What breeds besides New Hampshire and Barnevelder would you recommend for a rooster?

 

[Lady of McCamley]

We were given the little silkie by a friend. Quite a few of her hens have raised clutches I consider large for a small breed (4 or 5 babies). There's more breeders near by. I'll have to find out what breeds they keep.
What breeds besides New Hampshire and Barnevelder would you recommend for a rooster?

What are your goals?
Eggs?
Meat?
Dual?
Free range?
Confinement?
Egg color?
Sex linking?
Temperament?
Cold hardy?
Heat hardy?

Set your goals and buy accordingly. Good roosters are often cheap, or even free, and an excellent return on your flock investment.

Typically certain breeds are known for mellower roosters. Never breed from an overly aggressive one.

Let me know your goals and I'll make suggestions.

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Having had time to come back to this question while at my computer...I can recommend not to get a Production red rooster or hatchery RIR. Those tend to be pretty aggressive.

If your goal is mostly eggs (hinted at in original post), then you want to focus on good laying breeds with an alert but mellow temperament.

New Hampshire would be excellent, especially since over your Barred Rock hen you would get black sex links. Even hatchery stock New Hampshire (while not particularly SOP in coloring) can be nice. They boys come to table in a reasonable time, about 20 to 24 weeks. The girls are good layers of especially large eggs.

Delaware, if from a good breeder, can be productive birds. Mine tended to be a bit aggressive (and I got mine from a breeder). Delaware lay larger eggs so you would be building that into the flock. They do have larger floppy combs.

Barred Rock roosters are often pleasant (though not always) but will make all offspring barred, and breed backs will eventually get you to double barred males and single barred females. BRs are excellent layers and hardy birds. Crosses from them would be nicely productive.

I would stay away from the Leghorns unless you don't mind that your flock will be lighter, flightier, and have heavier combs (harder in cold areas). However, you have the hens to calm the temperament, and the Leghorn blood would add productivity to all hen lines.

Orpingtons can be pleasant, but in my experience hatchery stock can be quite aggressive and not particularly good layers. Neither were they in my experience particularly good feed to egg conversion. They were my heaviest eaters and lightest layers. They can go broody, so you might increase that likelihood. Some hatcheries are much better quality in Orpingtons than others.

Wyandottes from a good line are decent layers and overall well tempered. I've had a couple more aggressive. They tend to be a heavier bird so the feed to egg conversion is not as ideal as a Barred Rock. Wyandottes do have a rose comb which is better for frost. Rose is dominant so all off spring would become rose combed, although over your EE/Ameraucana would become walnut combed....also good for cold weather.

Buckeyes are EXCELLENT dual purpose, if you get a Buckeye from a better laying line. The roosters are really sweet tempered. The roos come to table pretty fast for a heritage breed. I've been able to butcher around 16 weeks and have a decent carcass (if they are fed right). They are not super layers, but are decent layers especially in winter. You would add body weight to all your offspring, while reducing egg slightly.
The pea comb of the Buckeye makes it a good choice for cold weather. The pea comb over the rose comb Wyandottes would produce walnut like your Silkie. The rest would get a pea comb....with some funk until breed backs straighten it out eventually...but still better for colder weather than a full single comb.

My thoughts using typical hatchery stock or common breeds.

Good luck finding the right boy.

LofMc

 

[Naser]

The chances are the offspring hens will be poor layers and broody, If you want good layers from mixed breeds get Rhode Island Red rooster, most of commercial egg layers are fathered by RIR rooster.

 

[MustangCreekBunsnChicks]

Having had time to come back to this question while at my computer...I can recommend not to get a Production red rooster or hatchery RIR. Those tend to be pretty aggressive.

If your goal is mostly eggs (hinted at in original post), then you want to focus on good laying breeds with an alert but mellow temperament.

New Hampshire would be excellent, especially since over your Barred Rock hen you would get black sex links. Even hatchery stock New Hampshire (while not particularly SOP in coloring) can be nice. They boys come to table in a reasonable time, about 20 to 24 weeks. The girls are good layers of especially large eggs.

Delaware, if from a good breeder, can be productive birds. Mine tended to be a bit aggressive (and I got mine from a breeder). Delaware lay larger eggs so you would be building that into the flock. They do have larger floppy combs.

Barred Rock roosters are often pleasant (though not always) but will make all offspring barred, and breed backs will eventually get you to double barred males and single barred females. BRs are excellent layers and hardy birds. Crosses from them would be nicely productive.

I would stay away from the Leghorns unless you don't mind that your flock will be lighter, flightier, and have heavier combs (harder in cold areas). However, you have the hens to calm the temperament, and the Leghorn blood would add productivity to all hen lines.

Orpingtons can be pleasant, but in my experience hatchery stock can be quite aggressive and not particularly good layers. Neither were they in my experience particularly good feed to egg conversion. They were my heaviest eaters and lightest layers. They can go broody, so you might increase that likelihood. Some hatcheries are much better quality in Orpingtons than others.

Wyandottes from a good line are decent layers and overall well tempered. I've had a couple more aggressive. They tend to be a heavier bird so the feed to egg conversion is not as ideal as a Barred Rock. Wyandottes do have a rose comb which is better for frost. Rose is dominant so all off spring would become rose combed, although over your EE/Ameraucana would become walnut combed....also good for cold weather.

Buckeyes are EXCELLENT dual purpose, if you get a Buckeye from a better laying line. The roosters are really sweet tempered. The roos come to table pretty fast for a heritage breed. I've been able to butcher around 16 weeks and have a decent carcass (if they are fed right). They are not super layers, but are decent layers especially in winter. You would add body weight to all your offspring, while reducing egg slightly.
The pea comb of the Buckeye makes it a good choice for cold weather. The pea comb over the rose comb Wyandottes would produce walnut like your Silkie. The rest would get a pea comb....with some funk until breed backs straighten it out eventually...but still better for colder weather than a full single comb.

My thoughts using typical hatchery stock or common breeds.

Good luck finding the right boy.

LofMc

A friend of mine said she would sell me some orpingtons, Easter Eggers, or production red x RIR when we get ready for a few more. She culls for temperaments in her rabbits and is most likely the same with the birds. I have been interested in getting some orpingtons. They're pretty and make good layers. I think I have become more invested in these chickens than I had planned on

 

[Naser]

. I think I have become more invested in these chickens than I had planned on

Common problem

 

[Lady of McCamley]

A friend of mine said she would sell me some orpingtons, Easter Eggers, or production red x RIR when we get ready for a few more. She culls for temperaments in her rabbits and is most likely the same with the birds. I have been interested in getting some orpingtons. They're pretty and make good layers. I think I have become more invested in these chickens than I had planned on

A nice RIR rooster makes good breeding into most lines as they provide hardiness, production, and if breeder quality, some body weight. Many lines to add RIR blood for that.

If she is culling for temperament, it could be a good choice.

LofMc