Livestock guardian dogs

[SD Bird Lady]

Thank you centrarchid for the explanation, that makes sense. We don't have a LGD only a corgi who is afraid of the top hen haha I think the cat is more to fear than him. I have always been amazed at what dogs are capable of!

 

[centrarchid]

Thank you centrarchid for the explanation, that makes sense. We don't have a LGD only a corgi who is afraid of the top hen haha I think the cat is more to fear than him. I have always been amazed at what dogs are capable of!

Corgi would be suitable against my fox issue if birds stayed together but would not be fast enough to deal with Coopers hawk nor tough enough to deal with coyote, stray dogs or racoon. A pack of corgis might be up to task but I would not tell anyone for fear of being laughed at.

My top dog dominates all flock members except hens with chicks. Hens will flog him and he submits. He will still tear after anything riling up hen even if it results in getting flogged himself. So being a wus with chickens does not make dog useless against predators.

 

[farmer boy]

well i seen my roos crowing or making loud noises at the bald eagles and the bald eagles were doing it back .. i had a hawk come in and try to take my biggest and heavy'est hen but he couldn't lift her up lol ... well my husky mix is the fighter he will fight with anything if he gets out he will come back with a coon adult coon if it is close to the house if he will try to take on a big rottweiler i think he can take a coyote their a lot smaller then that and as of my other dogs idk if my pitbull would he follows my big dog if my big dog attacks he attacks and my sheep dog usually wont attack to but sometimes she did

 

[Howling Wolf]

They are used quite successfully. For much more information and postings of available rescue/adoption daily, US & Canada, please join our FB group, LIVESTOCK GUARD DOG PROJECT.

 

[CASDOG1]

Hello! I found this forum when a link to this thread was posted on a livestock guardian dog forum I help run. I breed working Central Asian Shepherd Dogs along with my co-breeder, who also breeds spotted Nubian goats. Naturally we both have chickens as well. We also assist with our local Anatolian Shepherd rescue & currently have several rescued Anatolian & Pyrenees working dogs along with our Central Asians.

I was very sad to see the loss of this beautiful Great Pyrenees. I just wanted to say that there are two reasons why Pyrs are the most commonly killed LGDs in this country. The first reason is because they are simply the most common & well known livestock guardian breed. If someone is just learning about LGDs, more than likely the Great Pyrenees is the breed they have heard of & the breed they will seek. Sadly, this popularity also means MANY people are breeding inferior specimens & it is becoming harder & harder to find quality working Pyrenees.

The second reason is because people tend to not use enough dogs. One dog is NEVER enough, no matter how aggressive or powerful. These are dogs, not robots. They need to sleep & take breaks. A single dog alone becomes exhausted trying to cover everything all the time. A single dog can't handle a pack & pack predators are often smart enough to figure out how to draw the dog off & kill it while sending their compatriots in to attack the livestock. If you are dealing with large numbers of pack predators, or have large predators like cougars, you are going to need a pack that can match the threat. Many operations may need half a dozen dogs or more, especially if you are also needing the dogs to protect a large area.

We use two types of guardian dogs, flock guardians & perimeter guardians. We have Pyrs as well as Anatolian Shepherds, which are both flock guardians, to stay right with the livestock, & we use the more aggressive Central Asian Shepherds (which we also breed), which is a perimeter guardian breed, to patrol the boundaries of the property. The perimeter guardian breeds are much more aggressive & tend to be superior fighters so will attack & kill predators which continue to show up night after night. The perimeter dogs combined with the flock dogs makes an unbeatable livestock guardian team, with the Central Asians acting as shock troops & the Pyrs & ASDs acting as the home guard.

If you are considering using livestock guardian dogs for the first time, I strongly urge you to get a good idea of what predators you are dealing with & then select your chosen breed or breeds. Then look for breeders who are breeding the best working stock. Do not look for a breeder who is crossbreeding perimeter guardian types to flock guardian types, as the two types of guarding style will not occur in the same dog. After all, a dog can't stay with the stock & stay at the fenceline simultaneously. You want BOTH types of dogs, at least 1 one of each, if that is the route you choose to go.

 

[drumstick diva]

Also from what I've come to understand from reading about livestock guardian dogs on this site, is that you either make a pet out of them or a livestock protector. In other words to do their job they have to spend their life with the flock, or herd, or whatever you want protected. Having them in the home - the dogs don't bond with the flock. I think the op wanted to start the pup in the house and then eventually wean it to being outside. It seems to me that would just produce a dog that is anxious outdoors and trying to get back inside with his people.- To heck with the chickens.

 

[jdywntr]

Also from what I've come to understand from reading about livestock guardian dogs on this site, is that you either make a pet out of them or a livestock protector. In other words to do their job they have to spend their life with the flock, or herd, or whatever you want protected. Having them in the home - the dogs don't bond with the flock. I think the op wanted to start the pup in the house and then eventually wean it to being outside. It seems to me that would just produce a dog that is anxious outdoors and trying to get back inside with his people.- To heck with the chickens.

I have read and heard the same thing alot too. I do disagree though. We have a 5 month old Grt Pyr and he is inside for now. He does chicken chores with me and is very respectful of the birds. I want my LGD to be bonded with me, otherwise why would he listen to me. He also plays with our small inside dogs. I wouldn't want to have to protect my small dogs from an unsocialized LGD adult. I spoke with others on BYC and on backyardherds.com (BYCs sister site) and many people raise their first LGD inside then when grown and trustworthy, they are moved outside. There is someone on backyardherds.com that raises Caucasion Ovtcharkas (sp) and she rotates them every 2-3 months from goats to sheep to poultry to inside.

I completely disagree with people that think that LGDs should just be raised with their flock (maybe okay for those with hundreds of acres where the flock is out on the range alone all the time). LGDs still get injured and need a vet so should be able to go on a car ride, should not have to tranquilized in order to recieve care and should have enough manners and obeidience to not just attack anything that moves.

The problem I see where I live is that SO many people breed LGDs or mixed LGDs that shouldn't be bred. Poor temperment and poor working ability have no place in a working dog.

My pup is happy to sleep inside but is just as thrilled to be out wandering among the birds. He is just starting to pick up scents and follow them. Our neighbors Pyr came by a few weeks back (a VERY friendly dog) and my little guy wouldn't come within 20' of him and then growled and ran away. I will move him outside part time at night when he is a little older and then full time at 1.5-2 years. We got him at 8 weeks and sticking him outside then would have made him coyote bait.

 

[insanity]

My Mastiff Echo was raised around my girls and will even sleep out by the pen sometimes. My hens are never on lock down and free roam a 1/3 acre(unnetted) garden lot at will. I've only had one incident with the neighbors dog and she permanently cured him. I know there is coon, fox, coyote, and large birds in the area but none have cause problems. I think Echos presence has had alot to do with that.Breed makes a difference though our Australian Shepard can't be trusted for a second and its not that she doesn't know better she just really wants to herd them.

 

[classyraven]

I have Maremmas. They are great with the birds once they are out of the "puppy" stage. Used to loose alot to raccoon, fox, and coyote. A working pair is always better then a single.

 

[centrarchid]

Also from what I've come to understand from reading about livestock guardian dogs on this site, is that you either make a pet out of them or a livestock protector. In other words to do their job they have to spend their life with the flock, or herd, or whatever you want protected. Having them in the home - the dogs don't bond with the flock. I think the op wanted to start the pup in the house and then eventually wean it to being outside. It seems to me that would just produce a dog that is anxious outdoors and trying to get back inside with his people.- To heck with the chickens.

I have been doing this enough to see the rules of thumb regarding LGD's and small ruminants (sheep and goats) for which the dogs where bred to defend are not generally appropriate with guarding of chickens.

You can go both ways with dogs and poultry although management differs greatly. Dogs all outside constantly can be less headache; but if household open like mine, then dogs have freedom of movement between house and area(s) where poultry are located. Negatives of the open household is risk of livestock (chickens here or horses back home) coming into house, dogs bringing catch into house and dogs tracking up place when ground is wet. We sweep more than most and might as well have dirt floors. What does not work is having dogs confined to house when baddies visit. Dog breed can be a factor but training can over-ride most genetic issues. During cold weather my dogs favor house but they will not hesitate to boil out after anyone they do not like and / or whenever birds start making a ruckus. The dogs are much better than I at determining when someone visits. With my poultry, multiple flocks are involved during production season and they are not all that close together. Dogs using porch or shade tree away from flocks still enables them to monitor their territory.

My dogs do not bond with flock despite effort to imprint them as pups, although dogs do seem to retain a different relationship with birds they were penned with. Efforts did make subsequent interactions between dogs and birds easier to control. From what I have seen, the habits of chickens will not make bonding adventagous anyway since birds do not stay a single group nor do they move far from a roost. The moving of flock as a group over large areas would require bonding. The dog needs to be bonded more to area with respect to poultry.