May trade for a new horse thoughts please?

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LOL. It is basically the very-young-racehorses equivalent of a horse dealer... someone who buys and sells a lot of horses, turning them around quickly for a profit, such as buying cheaply-acquireable weanlings and feeding and polishing them up over the winter to sell at a profit in six months. By extension, doing the same thing on any horses -- making a large part of your livelihood by what in the real estate world would be called "flipping". Sometimes there is an implication of shady dealings, but this is not necessarily the case -- there are SOME very good horsemen in the world who can do well at this simply because they are very good at recognizing diamonds in the rough and negotiating good deals.

As an aside... I know horse dealers get a bad rap, and certainly it is often well-deserved
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, but you know, I grew up riding at a barn where the owner did probably about 1/3 of his business from lessons, 1/3 of his business from mostly B/C-rated hunter shows and hunting with the local pack, and about 1/3 of his business buying meat-price type horses from the New Holland auction and turning them around and reselling them for whatever their abilities suited. I am not saying that, if you wanted papers to go with a certain horse, it couldn't sometimes become whatever breed of horse you happened to want papers on
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. But you know, on the whole, he was basically honest most of the time; was an EXCELLENT judge of horses -- it was pretty rare that he'd end up sending a horse *back* to New Holland on the basis of "oops, cannot actually fix up and resell after all", and those few were mostly horses with severe back problems that were not apparent unless bearing a rider's weight; and he got a HUGE number of horses OUT of the slaughter stream and into productive happy homes, be it as put-the-kid-up-occasionally pasture pets or as rated-show hunters or jumpers, depending on the horse.

The trick is to be plugged into the local horse community well enough that you know which dealers it is okay to buy from (and, up to what limits <g>), and which ones to stay away from because they are shadier than you can realistically hope to cope with.

Pat
 
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She's right the trick is being plugged in enough to the local community. That's much, much harder when one goes out of town. You are better off on your home turf.

Pinhooker used to mean someone who dealt around the track. But these days, it can be used to indicate anyone who sells a lot of horses quickly. It kind of implies they don't put a lot of training or work into the horse and sell quick. As one told me, 'Heck, I can take that grey horse and turn around and sell it tomorrow for three thousand more. People DO love a grey horse'.

That doesn't mean a pinhooker doesn't have some real useful horses to sell. Often s/he does...you just have to know what you're doing. Personally I would much rather them for a family/pleasure horse than almost any private seller, who thinks his anonymity is a guarantee he can do and say anything he wants!

Pat's right in that someone who buys and sells horses is not necessarily 'a bad thing'. They aren't all always being dishonest!

On the other hand, even the best dealer gets 'stuck' with a bad horse he needs to move once in a while.

But most people...if you let them talk, they will tell you a lot, all you have to do is listen.

We had an 'old time' dealer near us, and I thought he was great. People got mad at him, though, for 'telling the truth'. He was perfectly comfortable telling some young show off, 'You need old Quiet Old Bob here, not that youngster' or 'this horse is not a fancy sport horse like what you think you need, but he's the type of mover you need to be sitting on to learn to ride better'. His prices were 'already fair and firm'. Not a whole lot of bargaining going on. If you were a beginner and listened to him, you'd go home with a safe reliable horse. Oddly, people loved the local pinhooker who played into their fantasies a whole lot more!! The promise of a 'real steal' at a 'great price', they just could not resist her shpiel. You might spend more at the old dealer's place but he was a decent chap mostly.

The 'burden of the choice' is always on the buyer, though. S/he really needs to be looking for an appropriate horse and verify that it's healthy.

Too, 'sound', 'healthy', 'quiet', these all mean very, very different things to different people.

'Healthy' often means no major problems with heart, eyes and breathing. 'Sound' often means 'serviceable if kept in the right kind of program'. .

What's 'quiet' to a trainer may honestly be something very, very different for a novice. My 'quiet' horse sent another novice screaming from the ring, LOL. She wouldn't even ride in the same with with us after, LOL. I can't even remember what the old dude did that scared her so much. Maybe gave one little tiny Happy Buck, dear old sweet thing, LOL.
 
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Conversely, although it is not *often* the case, the seller's "spooky crazy dangerous" horse may turn out to just snort occasionally and prick its ears. My half-Lipizzaner was acquired originally on free-lease, converted to ownership, from someone who had bought him as a youngster because he was purty and her moron/shyster "trainer" who had bought him and was looking to resell told her that she could make a lot of money off him. The "trainer" turned out to be able to do nothing more than put intermediate lesson kids on the horse to whiz around at racecar speed, so she took the horse home and kept him in her pasture. Being half Lipizzaner and half Morab, he is very smart and sensible but ALSO does have the breed-appropriate tendency to respond to something new by putting his head up in the air, arching his neck picturesquely, and snorting like tractor-trailer air brakes. This was interpreted by his novice owner as "he's crazy, he's dangerous, he's about to do something very very bad". In reality, nothing ever happens beyond the pricked ears and Breyer horse posing and snorts, and he is a great horse.

Mind you, it is still my experience that the great MAJORITY of horses advertised as spooky-crazy-dangerous do have significant problems (as do a number of the ones advertised as quiet, lol).

But you do get the occasional very quiet, very fun half-Lipp thrown your way for free, if you keep an open mind and aren't in a hurry
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(He is retired now, but is still a good [and handsome, if rather whale-shaped] pasture-based alert system to tell me if the sheep are loose or a coyote is in the back field or a leaf has fallen off a tree somewhere <g>)

Pat
 
All's I seem to have uploaded anywhere is a couple pics of him and my elder TB goggling at the sheeps when they were new -- not very good or flattering pics, but oh well:

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Pat
 
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He is for sure half-Lipp, I have seen his halfbred papers from LANA or whichever registry it was; It was a long time ago that I dealt with all this and I don't remember for *sure* now, but I *think* he is by Pluto II Dixana or Pluto II Dixana II, whichever was standing in Michigan for a good while in the '80s.

Sorry to distract from thread topic
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Pat
 
I'm going to say this is the best fit of any that have been posted by anyone here:

1603205

Cricket. Half Percheron, Half Quarter Horse mare. Beginner safe, black with 4 white ankles and a star and snip. 1450 lbs, 16 hands. 11 years old.

"Cricket is an amazingly quiet mare. She has many trail miles on her and would be great for a beginner rider looking for a quiet mount. Her gaits are very smooth and comfortable to ride with dressage potential. Please do not e-mail with questions, instead call Chuck @ 509-999-6565."

Full drafts are generally much cheaper than draft crosses(except for draft-QH crosses, which are usually priced very well)

You're right, WC, this mare does sound ideal and worth a second look!


Rusty​
 

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