Not an Emergency...Marek's in the Flock

[Nambroth]

so what do you do if you are force to get rid of birds possibly exposed to mareks? I might have to leave where I live and can't take birds. this is a bad situation.

It might be in your best interest to get tested... You can either cull them (sad!) or if you want to give them away, just do so with full disclosure. "My flock might have Marek's disease, which is a highly contagious virus to other chickens, and it is often terminal once symptoms show. You are adopting these birds at your own risk and by taking them you agree that you understand what Marek's disease is and how it is spread.". I doubt you'll get many takers, but it is about your only option.

It is VERY IMPORTANT TO NOTE that depending on the serotype of Marek's you have (or don't have...) any other flock might be carrying a different type.
This is sort of hard to explain but essentially the different strains of Marek's will show the SAME symptoms, but a chicken that is immune to serotype 1 Marek's may not be immune to serotype 2. Essentially, unless you know exactly what your flock is infected with, even giving them to someone that already has Marek's in their flock can be risky. They might be carrying a different strain. You could do harm to BOTH flocks in this way.

 

[julie0477]

Wow
,

Wow! Thanks so much for all that info. I wasn't questioning what you all were saying about the does I was giving being to weak. As I said those directions came from 2 seperate vets. I think there is some confusion out there in the chicken world as the package is labeled for calves not chickens. At least my package is. The above info actually speaks to poultry.

I am still confused as, unless I've read this wrong, the dose for calves and chickens appears to be the same. That doesn't seem possible to my little brain.

Based on all this info, I think it's best to skip the 4 day break and get these babies treated correctly once and for all.

Again, thank you so much for all this info.

keep in mind it's in the drinking water and chickens will drink for their body weight - much less than say a cow. So even if the dose is close or the same per gallon , they aren't getting the same amount.

 

[seminolewind]

First let me start by saying that I mean no offense to anyone and I apologize in advance if I have upset you, but I cannot help myself when it comes to matters of dosing, lol. Second, if I have made an error in my math, please let me know and I'll fix it.

The Corid dose for treatment is *not* 1/2 teaspoon, not sure who came up with that, but it's wrong and people keep repeating it. FYI, I used to tell people that the dose was 1/2 teaspoon and for that I was wrong and I feel really bad about it. From now on I will not repeat things I have read here on BYC unless I have also read that same info from a reliable, published source.
The info below is from a thread I started:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/users/subscriptions/index/view/threads

Due to some confusion on dose amounts regarding the powder, I decided to do some research and this is what I have so far. For those of you that use powder Corid, if you have been using 1/2 teaspoon per gallon (~270mg) you haven't been using enough.

The preventative dose (.006%) for Corid Powder is 1/3 teaspoon.
The preventative dose (.006%) for Corid liquid is 1/2 teaspoon.

The moderate outbreak dose (.012%) for Corid Powder is 3/4 teaspoon.
The moderate outbreak dose (.012%) for Corid liquid is 1 teaspoon.

The severe outbreak dose (.024%) for Corid Powder is 1.5 teaspoons
The severe outbreak dose (.024%) for Corid liquid is 2 teaspoon.

Corid mixing instructions for preventative (.006%) and moderate (.012%) outbreak dosing.
http://www.corid.com/SiteCollectionDocuments/CORID Slim Jim-All.pdf

Amprol 20% powder:
http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/a/amp128.pdf

Amprol 9.6% liquid:
http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/a/amp96.pdf

FDA recommendations:
http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/animaldrugsatfda/details.cfm?dn=013-149
"Chickens
Indications: For the treatment of coccidiosis.
Amount: Administer at the 0.012 percent level in drinking water as soon as coccidiosis is diagnosed and continue for 3 to 5 days (in severe outbreaks, give amprolium at the 0.024 percent level); continue with 0.006 percent amprolium-medicated water for an additional 1 to 2 weeks."

And this link has these instructions:
http://www.drugs.com/vet/amprol-9-6-solution-can.html
"Poultry - as Soon As Caecal Coccidiosis Is Diagnosed, Give 0.024% Amprolium In The Drinking Water For 5 To 7 Days. Continue The Treatment With 0.006% Amprolium Medicated Water For An Additional One To Two Weeks. No Other Source Of Drinking Water Should Be Available To The Birds During This Time."

Here's the math, let me know if I made an error.

• There are 200mg of amprolium in every 1 gram of powder.
• 1 ounce = 3.5 tablespoons = 28.35 grams
• 200mg x 28.35 = 5670mg in 3.5 tablespoons of powder.
• There are 10.5 teaspoons in 3.5 tablespoons
• There are 21 1/2 teaspoons in 10.5 teaspoons
• 5670mg divided by 21 1/2 teaspoons = ~270mg per 1/2 teaspoon
• There are two 1/4 teaspoons per 1/2 teaspoon
• 270 mg divided by 2 = 135mg per 1/4 teaspoon

Amount of Amprolium (Corid or Amprol) powder per 1/4 teaspoon
​

• One 1/4 teaspoon = 135 mg
• 1/2 teaspoon = 270 mg
• 3/4 teaspoon =405 mg
• 1 teaspoon = 540 mg
• 1 & 1/4 teaspoons = 675 mg
• 1 & 1/2 teaspoons = 810 mg
• 1 & 3/4 teaspoons = 945 mg
• 2 teaspoons= 1080 mg

Amount of Amprolium (Corid or Amprol) liquid per 1/4 teaspoon
​

• One 1/4 teaspoon = 120 mg
• 1/2 teaspoon = 240 mg
• 3/4 teaspoons = 360 mg
• 1 teaspoon = 480 mg
• 1 & 1/4 teaspoons = 600 mg
• 1 & 1/2 teaspoons = 720 mg
• 1 & 3/4 teaspoons = 840
• 2 teaspoons = 960 mg

There are 4.92892ml/teaspoon, but the numbers above were calculated using 5ml/teaspoon

​

Here is what's in 1-10ml of the liquid

• 1ml = 96mg
• 2ml = 192mg
• 3ml = 288mg
• 4ml = 384mg
• 5ml = 480mg
• 6ml = 576mg
• 7ml = 672mg
• 8ml = 768mg
• 9ml = 864mg
• 10ml = 960mg

Bottom line, 1 teaspoon (540mg) of powder is equal to 5.625ml of liquid and 1/2 teaspoon powder (270mg) is equal to 2.8125ml liquid.

1/2 teaspoon of 20% powder = 2.8125ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 270mg of amprolium.
3/4 teaspoon of 20% powder = 4.21875ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 405mg of amprolium.
1 teaspoon of 20% powder = 5.625ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 540mg of amprolium.
1.5 teaspoons of 20% powder =8.4375ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 810mg of amprolium.
1.75 teaspoons of 20% powder = 9.84375ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 945mg of amprolium.
2 teaspoons of 20% powder = 11.25ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 1080mg of amprolium.



And if that doesn't convince people, here is another way I did it:

From:
http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/a/amp128.pdf:

Dosage Level Mixing Directions
0.024% Dissolve 8 ounces of AMPROL 128 20% Soluble Powder in about five gallons of water in a 50-gallon medication barrel. Stir, then add water to the 50 gallon mark. Stir thoroughly.
0.012% Follow same directions as above but use 4 ounces of AMPROL 128 20% Soluble Powder.
0.006% Follow same directions as above but use 2 ounces of AMPROL 128 20% Soluble Powder.

Facts

• One pack = 10 oz. (283.5 grams)
• One ounce = 28.35 grams
• One ounce of powder = ~3.5 tablespoons
• 200mg amprolium per 1 gram

My twisted math for the .024% level
If 8 ounces (28.35g x 8 = 226.8 grams) are needed for 50 gallons, then 1/50 of that is needed for 1 gallon, right? So that would be 226.8 grams divided by 50 = 4.536 grams per gallon. (doing this as I type, so correct me if I'm wrong, please!)

So how much does a teaspoon of Corid or Amprol powder weigh? Anyone know? Well, time to break out my gram scale and do some weighing... also have a call into the mfg of Corid and I'm expecting a call back from them.

Just got a call back from them and it is 4.536 grams per gallon. He also said that it's a very safe product and the risk of overdosing is very slim.

-Kathy


Disclaimer:
In the past I have treated my chicken chicks with 2 teaspoons of the liquid for 5-7 days, that's it, but I *might* try the .006% follow up the next time I have to treat chicks.

Kathy, 1 ounce = 2 TBLS, or 30ml, give or take. But I don't think it affected your math.

Corid dose , there's a lot of factors that are beyond our control. How much the chook will drink, how much will a sick bird drink, etc.
This is why I use a tsp per gallon. It's my happy medium.

With ml and grams, I worked with sick babies, and many times we used ml and gram as the same thing.
4.536 gram would be a teaspoon, give or take.

 

[casportpony]

One ounce of Corid powder is 3.5 tablespoons according to the Corid website. My issue is with people being told that 1/2 teaspoon of the powder is the same as 2 teaspoons of the liquid.

One ounce of liquid is pretty darn close to 2 tablespoons.

-Kathy

 

[casportpony]

More trivia... 1ml of water equals one gram, but 1ml of mercury equals 13.6 grams. Density, mass, volume, it all makes me feel like I am not smarter than a fith grader, lol.

And because I have a hard time wrapping my brain around this stuff I decided to weight 3.5 tablespoons of corn starch and it does weigh almost exactly 1 ounce.

-Kathy

 

[salt and pepper]

Ok, I know baytril is the BEST medicine. But, will Di-Methox work well? I'm working on a budget..... that's the reason why I'm reluctant to get baytril. but I that's the only thing that will work, so be it. The chickens are worse, and now have stopped laying. I need to do something NOW!

 

[casportpony]

Do you want to treat coccidiosis or a bacterial infection? Baytril will only work on bacterial infections, Di-methox will work for some bacteria and some strains of coccidia.

-Kathy

 

[schnebbles]

Nambroth - thanks - I hadn't looked at the strains like that.

this is just horrible, hard to watch and wonder.

 

[salt and pepper]

Do you want to treat coccidiosis or a bacterial infection? Baytril will only work on bacterial infections, Di-methox will work for some bacteria and some strains of coccidia.

-Kathy

I'm pretty sure that my chickens have infectious coryza. Pretty sure they don't have Cocci. The symptoms are swollen faces around eyes and nostrils, sneezing, and loss of egg production. I just want a product that will work.... even if it's pr icy. But if there's a cheaper med that will work as well,I'll take that!

 

[Eggcessive]

Sulfadimethoxine (Di-Methos, Albon, and Sulfamed G) is the best drug for coryza if that is what your chickens have. Sulmet can be used, but is hard on kidneys and liver. Here are 2 suppliers online, the first one has both liquid and powder if you scroll down: http://www.qcsupply.com/sulfadimethoxine-oral-solution-gallon.html

http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail....=34525656043&gclid=CL2firrg_7kCFYwWMgodmmIAFg