Organic Non GMO Wholesome Feed?

[shortgrass]

You seem to be a frustrated English teacher more than an organic farmer.  Are you sure that you're in the right profession?

Non of your links proved anything or provided evidence, scientific or otherwise that RoundUp is in anyway harmful to human or animal life and health.  As for scientific studies there has not been ANY reliable scientific studies, no not one that has found a link between RoundUp or its active ingredient [COLOR=333333]Glyphosate and any harm to the environment.  The only "so called" STUDY that tried to demonstrate a link between Glyphosate and harm to animals was a fraudulent "study" performed by an Anti-GMO activist named [/COLOR]Dr. Seralini.  Dr. Seralini's anti-GMO study was full of intentional lies and flagrant scientific fraud.  

Furthermore if you think that a domestic terrorist outfit like Green Peace is a reliable scientific origination, (as one of YOUR links lead) then there is no reason for me to continue this conversation because you are in denial of basic scientific facts.  But it is a basic scientific fact that over 2,000 honest scientific studies performed by scientist of all political stripes and persuasions has been conducted on GMO crops including RoundUp Ready crops and not a single ONE of these studies even begins to back up your contention. As for one of your links stating that Glyphosate resulted in an increase in microbes living in the soil, that is supposedly a benefit of Organic agricultural and the practice of using human and animal manure or other composted plant and animal materials to help grow food.  So tell us when is too many soil microbes too many soil microbes?  Or in other words isn't Organic agriculture also guilty of increasing the microbe count in dirt?

Ok conversation over. I do not play games and flaming is just not my stly.... Lol YOU are the one who claimed all this Round-up, Glyphosate harm to the environment... I backed that up, and now you are waffling and changing your viewpoint?

Sorry lol, I did not realize this was a flaming attempt... But in the meantime, I am sure happy to have shared this info with people that actually understand it and study it, as I'm sure this info is not generally known to the general public

No, I am not an English teacher lol, obviously you are not either... I am an Agronomy and organic chemistry grad; my dad was my Agronomy professor in college lol, so no... I think I made the right choice with my career, being as I am second in command if 2500 acres of farm ground and organic crops and beef.... Don't need an English major to spell a variety of wheat right.

Thanks for the enlightening debate; I'm glad I don't have to worry about you being a part of the crew that comes to inspect paperwork and soil samples next spring lol... It's obvious that you are conflicted in your theories, so come back later when you decide what you're talking about

 

[hyelaw]

Interesting reading....I just switched over to feeding my girls Organic Feed. They love it! Very pricey though, like $35.00 for a 40lb bag...YIKES! But I want Organic Eggs from my girls when they start laying in another couple of months, so the feed has to be Organic. I supplement their diet with fresh veggies and fruit scraps too.

What kind are you using?

 

[shortgrass]

I have been using scratch and peck feeds also.  They switched their pricing I think, with the shipping being included in the feed price now, not a tacked on additional charge.  It's available through Amazon also.  I think the feed averages $1.4 per pound.  (Is this outrageously expensive for feed?)  Unfortunately, not all their products are available to be shipped, only the smaller (25#) bags of chicken feed and grit, kelp, etc.  There is no retail store remotely close to me.

They will setup farm or wholesale accounts though, with a minimum order of 1 ton, and they do have non-gmo, organic soybeans and corn available, as well as oats, split peas, and barley.  Which would bring the price down to roughly $.88 per pound, depending on what you really order.

I would like to be able to find something more easily available, since I only have a very small flock and can't go through 1 ton of feed quickly enough.  But still everything I find has soybeans or corn in it.

Where ar you located? And how many birds are we looking at feeding? That's going to determine whether it's worth having to spend a day and a road trip to source their dinner

First, get the yellow pages and look up granaries, feed mills, grain dealers, feedlots, livestock feeding, or farm supplies... Lol best bet is in grain dealers... You might have to make a trip if there's no delivery, but the cost of shipping is adding almost 90% if your cost back into the feed.. Meaning the feed you can get for about .50 per pound is actually costing .90 to get to you...

And I do apologize if I am assuming that all areas will have a granary SOMEWHERE close by.... I guess maybe Florida might not lol, I have no clue in my bubble up here

I have had to make a special trip to the big city to get missing ingredients that the local granary didn't have. (Powdered molasses, ugh hard to source powder in cattle country lol)

The most expensive thing is going to be BOSS. Price per bushel(depending on crop, different weights) or CWT ( per 100 lbs) gets cheaper the more you buy... For example, I can go pick up a 40 lb bag of BOSS at the local big box feed store, like tractor supply... And it's $19.94. Makes it roughly .50 per pound. . but if I go get it at the grain elevator, its .24 per pound, but I gave to have my own sacks unless I want a ton dumped in my yard lol... The guy at the granary made me mad because all I needed 2 weeks ago was 200# of wheat middlings and he balked at having to load a mere 200#.

Needless to say, I called a different granary and reserved 500# for delivery next month, and will now switch suppliers. He lost their business from me, and I buy ALOT of grain lol... They'll do that, try to make you feel like its not worth their time. Don't le them do that lol

I'm all of a sudden feeling kind of guilty for having 15-20 different grain dealers to pick from over here and you are struggling to find ONE.

Lol...I got 500# of wheat off the side of the road on Sunday when a combine cleaned our for corn harvest and left me 3 months worth of feed I hope he comes back lol...

 

[hyelaw]

Where ar you located? And how many birds are we looking at feeding? That's going to determine whether it's worth having to spend a day and a road trip to source their dinner

First, get the yellow pages and look up granaries, feed mills, grain dealers, feedlots, livestock feeding, or farm supplies... Lol best bet is in grain dealers... You might have to make a trip if there's no delivery, but the cost of shipping is adding almost 90% if your cost back into the feed.. Meaning the feed you can get for about .50 per pound is actually costing .90 to get to you...

And I do apologize if I am assuming that all areas will have a granary SOMEWHERE close by.... I guess maybe Florida might not lol, I have no clue in my bubble up here

I have had to make a special trip to the big city to get missing ingredients that the local granary didn't have. (Powdered molasses, ugh hard to source powder in cattle country lol)

The most expensive thing is going to be BOSS. Price per bushel(depending on crop, different weights) or CWT ( per 100 lbs) gets cheaper the more you buy... For example, I can go pick up a 40 lb bag of BOSS at the local big box feed store, like tractor supply... And it's $19.94. Makes it roughly .50 per pound. . but if I go get it at the grain elevator, its .24 per pound, but I gave to have my own sacks unless I want a ton dumped in my yard lol... The guy at the granary made me mad because all I needed 2 weeks ago was 200# of wheat middlings and he balked at having to load a mere 200#.

Needless to say, I called a different granary and reserved 500# for delivery next month, and will now switch suppliers. He lost their business from me, and I buy ALOT of grain lol... They'll do that, try to make you feel like its not worth their time. Don't le them do that lol

I'm all of a sudden feeling kind of guilty for having 15-20 different grain dealers to pick from over here and you are struggling to find ONE.

Lol...I got 500# of wheat off the side of the road on Sunday when a combine cleaned our for corn harvest and left me 3 months worth of feed

I hope he comes back lol...

I'm in Central Ohio. And I have 17 birds currently, but some are probably going to hop into my freezer soon (hopefully). I'm aiming for 12 birds, which will be layers and/or pets. And I have guineas and turkeys so would prefer something that doesn't put a lot of weight on them.

Traveling far probably won't justify it. There are mills around but I must admit I don't trust / like what they are selling. If any, only a small percentage of their supplies are organic, and the local feeds I've found still contain soy and corn. I also get paranoid about cross contamination. So I am willing to pay a little extra for peace of mind.

For the BOSS, do you know of an organic, or at least guaranteed chemical free supplier? Or do some feed mills carry them? I would like to have my feed be 100% organic / non-gmo / chemical free. But it's the extras that I feed them that I haven't been able to guarantee (BOSS, safflower, nyjer, etc.). At this point it's only 98%

And, so you mix your own feed? If so, I'd love to know your recipe. I've used calculators that I've found online, but I'm still not very confident. It's any essential vitamins / minerals that I'm worried my homemade feed might be lacking.

None of this would be a problem if I had more birds, because I'd just buy the feed in bulk.

 

[hyelaw]

I have also started to ferment their feed. It was a slow start, but they seem to like it now.

And they do free range some. We haven't gotten them down to a routine yet. It was only for short periods after work, then we let them free all day, but they started behaving badly (heading to the road or neighbor's yard) so they are back to being in the run while unsupervised.

Anything green is gone form the run, even after my attempt of reseeding, so now I'm growing fodder... These little brats are a lot of work!

 

[pdirt]

Thank you @shortgrass for putting an end to chickengeorgeto's misinformation attempt. I have been reading his/her stuff for a couple of years now. Sometimes I agreed, but usually not. Your response finally cleared the air for me, I think you nailed it in the waffling. I mean no ill will to anyone, but I do not like wasting my time. I wish everyone on this forum the best.

 

[HeritageGoose13]

And, so you mix your own feed? If so, I'd love to know your recipe. I've used calculators that I've found online, but I'm still not very confident. It's any essential vitamins / minerals that I'm worried my homemade feed might be lacking.

I know you weren't asking me, but there are many recipes on BYC. They can be hard to find, but here's a bunch that are tried and true:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/1003171/the-great-big-homemade-chicken-feed-recipe-sharing-thread

There are corn-free and soy-free options there.

 

[shortgrass]

Thank you @shortgrass for putting an end to chickengeorgeto's misinformation attempt. I have been reading his/her stuff for a couple of years now. Sometimes I agreed, but usually not. Your response finally cleared the air for me, I think you nailed it in the waffling. I mean no ill will to anyone, but I do not like wasting my time. I wish everyone on this forum the best.

You are welcome.

I really was just clarifying for everyone; I have seen numerous occasions of it simply being misinformation, or social media maybe getting someone all excited over nothing.... I was and still am truly hoping it was just a failure to communicate effectively....

And if not, lol, then that's why I poke my nose in here and there to see what the fuss is, and lo and behold, I seen to not be able to have to chime up, bad habit... I'm not good at keeping mum when its something I've worked my entire life for being literally, slandered.

Hopefully, it was and can still be a learning experience; that's why I posted, to teach, not to inflame

 

[shortgrass]

I'm in Central Ohio.  And I have 17 birds currently, but some are probably going to hop into my freezer soon (hopefully).  I'm aiming for 12 birds, which will be layers and/or pets.  And I have guineas and turkeys so would prefer something that doesn't put a lot of weight on them.

Traveling far probably won't justify it.  There are mills around but I must admit I don't trust / like what they are selling.  If any, only a small percentage of their supplies are organic, and the local feeds I've found still contain soy and corn.  I also get paranoid about cross contamination.  So I am willing to pay a little extra for peace of mind. 

For the BOSS, do you know of an organic, or at least guaranteed chemical free supplier?  Or do some feed mills carry them?  I would like to have my feed be 100% organic / non-gmo / chemical free.  But it's the extras that I feed them that I haven't been able to guarantee (BOSS, safflower, nyjer, etc.).  At this point it's only 98%

And, so you mix your own feed?  If so, I'd love to know your recipe.  I've used calculators that I've found online, but I'm still not very confident.  It's any essential vitamins / minerals that I'm worried my homemade feed might be lacking.

None of this would be a problem if I had more birds, because I'd just buy the feed in bulk.

Well I had fun looking some stuff up for ya... I was thinking you probably had a good size population of Amish, Yiddish, Mennonites, the like.... You should have no problem sourcing organic non GMO if you can buddy up with them

Their sorghum is top notch bar none, well worth a look in to for your own personal use, hint hint..

So, first, just in case nobody else has it, a feed calculator, tada...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...SxuBjk&usg=AFQjCNFH33vo38kMncgcbuH79bc2brhTew

BTW I hope all these come up ok, lol computers are NOT my forte

And how to read a forage analysis...comes in handy, lots of acronyms...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...SxuBjk&usg=AFQjCNGjNBpZzR0VKdXYYawn6bkUuqY4uA

Then a feed guide...this should have a complete list of grains and legumes, forages...and all their nutritional value...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...SxuBjk&usg=AFQjCNFA2l5zZlz71uumgr5oaQ6Anmgjng

Ok, and here is a list of livestock nutrient needs...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...SxuBjk&usg=AFQjCNE9a2Q3q481jBXbf9t9RnBn_UUxgw

So, between those 4 PDFs, you will end up with a million different recipes ha-ha... Lots of trial and error, and as you price different suppliers, you are going to end up knocking a few off the list completely.

I don't use soy. At all. Costs too much unless I can source non GMO seed, then I just grow whatever I need. That's not an option for most, I know... That's why I stat away from soy. That and with literally TONS if organic alfalfa hay at my fingertips, obviously I use alfalfa instead.

I am currently trying to cut my corn use by 50% by replacing it with wheat middlings... Saves me money, and actually end up with less poo from DECREASING their intake of indigestible fiber, but list a good amount if energy from cutting the corn, so I upped the millet, which also gives me more calcium than the corn did anyway

It's like a recipe for a soup, that always has A meat, A veggie, and A seasoning, but its not always the same...

Right now I just mixed a month of feed yesterday; (lol I even put pictures of it in my profile)

I used 50# of corn, 50# of wheat, 50# of millet, 70# of alfalfa/sorghum pellets(made to order at the granary), 30# oats, 30# BOSS, 10 lbs oyster shell, and 5# dry molasses...

Was hoping for the middling, I was going to cut the corn down to 25# and add in 25# of middlings, but next month I will


I found a bunch of suppliers, some in Ohio... I didn't wheedke through them all to compare prices, I saw a few that were pretty ridiculous, but a couple seemed fair depending on what they charge for shipping...

This is a list of organic suppliers, some non GMO as well...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...bPiClo&usg=AFQjCNGhpSOb1zJrHD9XMEOCbRZDBXU2Ww


Here's a bunch in Ohio that have birds, too, might be able to Co-op with them..

http://www.ec-ohio.com/freerange/

And a bunch more...
http://pleasanthillgrain.com/food/g...refdom=gpnbr&gclid=CKe6-6616scCFQ6raQodNpkB_w

http://organicfeeds.com

http://www.newcountryorganics.com/shop/poultry-feeds.html?gclid=CO2SoMy-6scCFQ0yaQodwk8BJQ

http://www.sunopta.com/about-us/non-GMO/?gclid=CKDptvq-6scCFYcCaQodbNUE6w

http://modestomilling.com/adw-cattle.html?gclid=CODB-N-16scCFQiLaQodjJEEcg

http://www.grainmillers.com/Feed_Ingredients.aspz

http://www.cottagecraftworks.com/amish-organic-wheat-berry-25-lb

I got sidetracked by a 4th grade homework assignment lol, so I am lost as to what I have posted or not ha-ha.. .


Well, here's a US organic suppliers list....I think that's it for now; I have to go help with quadrangles and a rhombus.

http://agritrue.com/sources-non-gmo-animal-feeds/
Hope it helps get a good start, and not a headache lol, you are right, these buggers can be a pain!

Edit* fixing links

 

[Missouri Julie]

Buchheit stores carry both organic and non-gmo poultry feeds. They are in Missouri and Illinois.