The Legbar Thread!

[GaryDean26]

I also attribute some of the lower weights to limited selection in the USA. If you are only able to get 2-3 chicks from your 6+ set of hatching eggs or as a trio of day old chicks from the local breeder and the availability makes it difficult to get more, then you aren't likly to be breeing a top 90% weight cockerel to a top 90% weight female. It is more likly you will be breeding average weight birds which will walk you down the latter on weight rather than maintianing weight in the top tier of the genetic potential of the gene pool.

 

[normanack]

I also attribute some of the lower weights to limited selection in the USA.  If you are only able to get 2-3 chicks from your 6+ set of hatching eggs or the local breeder and the availability makes it difficult to get more, then you are likely going to be working down the latter on the weight of birds than maitaining the weight of the birds in the top of the potential for the gene pool.

Yup. With my three treasured Cream Legbars, I figure my job right now is preserving the available gene pool rather than improving the breed. And I'm happy with that small role.

 

[dretd]

While it is difficult for some people to understand some of the more complicated genetic terminology, it also has a place in any breed discussion of color. Some people understand the words, some the symbols, and a few fortunate ones understand both.

If there is something posted that you think is incorrect, of course you have the right to say so. Personally I find the examples of colors in other breeds to be fascinating, and very helpful to the discussion.

Everyone has the right to just skip any posts they find distracting or confusing - I do all the time.

I do agree with your post. I think some of the problem comes when I see posts using photos from different breeds as examples and I am not sure exactly what point they are trying to support and sometimes for me the photos end up confusing the issue rather than clearing it up. IMO,sometimes really smart or highly educated people make an assumption that the person they are talking to has the same knowledge base they a have and forget to clarify/preface their words or label/caption the photos properly so there is no chance for cross-talking.

Additionally, I do think its important to realize that one should use kind words when posting because the tone and inflection is lost when writing and the words can come across as being rude or combative when they were not intended that way by the poster. I'm sure I have come off as rude sometimes when I am in a hurry and upon re-reading my post it really reads more rude than hurried.

On a personal note, I have found there is a bit of a disconnect between any academic with tons of book learning and someone whose point of view has been informed through experience. I cant tell you the number of times I have read every source on something and then found that the animal didn't read the textbook. Its not that the textbook is wrong, though, its more that it is incomplete.

I have run a number of mixed breed chicks I bred (know parentage, just cross bred) through the Chicken Calculator and I have yet to have one come up exactly as the algorithms in the Calculator predicted.Some are pretty far off. When you start using the symbols, you are making assumptions that you know the exact genetic makeup and will predict what will happen. The disconnect happens when the geneticist goes by the book and says 'its an x breed and so the genes are Aa Bb Cc' but the breeder breeds his chickens and gets a different answer than was predicted by the genetics expert. Then voila, there is a disconnect--what the book says vs what my chickens say-- frustration ensues.

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
I am Guilty of that.... I can clarify some of your questions

 

[1muttsfan]

When I have trouble understanding, I just

- or sometimes

. Usually means my brain cells are overloaded (not too hard to do!) and I just feel like

Besides, sometimes you just need to

 

[HaplessRunner]

When I have trouble understanding, I just

- or sometimes

. Usually means my brain cells are overloaded (not too hard to do!) and I just feel like

Besides, sometimes you just need to

This certainly made me smile.

 

[Pozees]

normanack I'm sort of in the same position right now. I have one cockerel and two pullets hatched from Papa Brooder eggs, one of the pullets is half the size of the other but has begun to catch up. All three I feel are quite small, but they are only 3.5 months old and I have no idea whether/how growth will continue. I also have one little pullet that hatched 3 weeks ago from Blackbird13, chick down is lighter than the other two pullets were. I have a friend who lives about an hour away who has birds from GFF, she has offered me chicks next spring, and I am certain to take her up on it. Until then, I have what I have. I adore the ones I have. For his diminutive stature, the cockerel is quite full of himself and already calls his ladies over to the food dish when I refill it, and has been working on his crow since he was 7 weeks old. If the pullets are as precocious and begin laying early, then I will use them and try to increase size as I select future breeders - while trying to preserve type and precocity. This precocity harkens back to the leghorn influence, I believe.

I have thoroughly enjoyed the discussion and pictures of various barring and dilution influences, and look forward to where it all settles out on correct type and color for the standard

 

[CibolaChooks]

Originally posted by dtred

On a personal note, I have found there is a bit of a disconnect between any academic with tons of book learning and someone whose point of view has been informed through experience. I cant tell you the number of times I have read every source on something and then found that the animal didn't read the textbook. Its not that the textbook is wrong, though, its more that it is incomplete.

I have run a number of mixed breed chicks I bred (know parentage, just cross bred) through the Chicken Calculator and I have yet to have one come up exactly as the algorithms in the Calculator predicted.Some are pretty far off.  When you start using the symbols, you are making assumptions that you know the exact genetic makeup and will predict what will happen. The disconnect happens when the geneticist goes by the book and says 'its an x breed and so the genes are Aa Bb Cc' but the breeder breeds his chickens and gets a different answer than was predicted by the genetics expert. Then voila, there is a disconnect--what the book says vs what my chickens say-- frustration ensues.
[/quote]


Steen
Very very very well put. Amen on that. This is my biggest complaint and you hit the nail right on the head. Im bad at grammer and what not but extreamly smart in other ways. Its not that i take someones help wrong i get frustrated when a book worm tells me im wrong and starts talking genetic gibberish and posting pics of other breeds. What their posting from the books they read isnt what i look at everyday right in front of me walking around. And if it is correct its not explained in a way that helps. And more often than not the op comments are completely disregarded and their told their wrong. This is hard to swallow when what youve observed and posted is walking around right in front of you

 

[KPenley]

normanack I'm sort of in the same position right now. I have one cockerel and two pullets hatched from Papa Brooder eggs, one of the pullets is half the size of the other but has begun to catch up. All three I feel are quite small, but they are only 3.5 months old and I have no idea whether/how growth will continue. I also have one little pullet that hatched 3 weeks ago from Blackbird13, chick down is lighter than the other two pullets were. I have a friend who lives about an hour away who has birds from GFF, she has offered me chicks next spring, and I am certain to take her up on it. Until then, I have what I have. I adore the ones I have. For his diminutive stature, the cockerel is quite full of himself and already calls his ladies over to the food dish when I refill it, and has been working on his crow since he was 7 weeks old. If the pullets are as precocious and begin laying early, then I will use them and try to increase size as I select future breeders - while trying to preserve type and precocity. This precocity harkens back to the leghorn influence, I believe.

I have thoroughly enjoyed the discussion and pictures of various barring and dilution influences, and look forward to where it all settles out on correct type and color for the standard

You are the second person in the past week who has mentioned a very small pullet. I had one as well, but she is practically the same as the others now. Are there any other breeders finding a midget/bantam like pullet in their hatched flocks?

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
You are correct, I am not a well articulated person when trying to explain how genetics work and I am sorry if that I have made you feel bad about it.. now keep in mind that the books I use as reference were published using research done by respectable people. Over decades of work and systematic testing because when they publish thing their work gets scrutinized by other scholars are researchers, now some people very dear to me, like Dr. Ron Okimoto(used to post at the coop long long ago) a geneticist, he sequenced many genes, and posted all of his research done at the University he used to work, he published all of this out of good will at the classroom at the coop forums. Now keep in mind that he was actually able to sequence the e allele ebc and compare it to eb and found them to be the same at the molecular level, he also found that show lines of Barred rock have Columbian on it and this actually helped on making the barring Crispt(aside from slow feathering sex linked gene) All in all Sorry…