UK Law change - all bird keepers must register their birds with DEFRA

[AGeese]

Please read this; it's from 2022 when the disease was still an issue.
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...lling-of-140m-farmed-birds-since-last-october

There are a lot of people involved at the top who think culling is not a good way to deal with such diseases. Those who are worried should try to find some figures for exactly how many backyard birds have been culled by officials in this latest H5N1 outbreak and what sort of percentage of all keepers they represent. Is this a real threat or a vanishingly unlikely one?

It is, btw, essentially over now. The whole UK has just moved to low risk status. Wild and domestic birds are acquiring immunity to it, as normal.

I love how the truth is typically reported after the fact. Fear sells, just exchange the number culled with actual fatalities due to the virus or comorbidity/infection and you have a recipe for fear.

A virus needs a living host to spread, so generally speaking it's those with weak or compromised immune systems at risk. The industry isn't selecting for strong immunity by culling, they're ensuring weak chickens with short life spans that can mature quick, be high producers, and die before they burn out.

There is no incentive for large commercial operations to test every bird, and isolate etc. It's the scorched earth policy instead totally unsustainable, and disturbing.

Heritage homestead birds for life!

 

[NatJ]

The industry isn't selecting for strong immunity by culling, they're ensuring weak chickens with short life spans that can mature quick, be high producers, and die before they burn out.

There is no incentive for large commercial operations to test every bird, and isolate etc. It's the scorched earth policy instead totally unsustainable, and disturbing.

For chickens that will never reproduce anyway, it probably does make more sense to kill them all and stop the spread. That would apply to most commercial layers, and all commercial meat birds that are butchered young. There is no point in selecting the ones that survive, unless you actually breed from those survivors.

Selectively breeding for immunity in the commercial birds would need to happen in the parent stock breeding flocks, not the big production facilities.

Heritage homestead birds for life!

For anyone who is breeding their chickens, I agree that selecting for resistance could be a good strategy.

 

[AGeese]

For chickens that will never reproduce anyway, it probably does make more sense to kill them all and stop the spread. That would apply to most commercial layers, and all commercial meat birds that are butchered young. There is no point in selecting the ones that survive, unless you actually breed from those survivors.

Selectively breeding for immunity in the commercial birds would need to happen in the parent stock breeding flocks, not the big production facilities.



For anyone who is breeding their chickens, I agree that selecting for resistance could be a good strategy.

For sure this is the system in place that supports the convenience and affordability for the modern lifestyle (don't buy into that feed-the-world-mantra.)

 

[Mid Wales chicken keeper]

Although it's a different country and all that... over here there has been a lot of culling of backyard flocks, so it might serve as an example of what could happen, and why people might be right to worry.

Here, when a flock or commercial outfit tests positive, ALL domestic Fowl within a certain distance are culled. The distance depends on the state / county. At least one was posted as 2 miles.
That's someone knocking on your door "The guy up the road tested positive so we're going to cull your flock."
No tests or symptoms needed.
It's not an annual inspection which is such a big deal, but what they do when there's an outbreak nearby. It's whether you as a flock owner have any right to get testing done before they are culled. And don't expect compensation for your losses.

There was a horrible story on here last spring from a lady whose flock did have some sick birds, and they came out to cull, the workers didn't know a lot about killing chickens humanely. She had to catch all her birds and hand them over one by one to be killed inside a trash can. Of course in her case it was necessary, but there were some mistakes and she was very traumatized.

Over here, as it stands, they only know about backyard flocks from the NPIP program and certain jurisdictions requiring permits. But once they roll personnel to deal with an outbreak they're going to check the records and see who has chickens or other fowl. That's what a database is for. And why I would not sign up for one here.

Sorry for such a late reply, you are absolutely right, the only reason for such a database is the slaughter of domestic birds, it's not enough to go after the farmers self sufficiency is being targeted

 

[Kevinsbirds]

Yes. I should have added that we are already registered with DEFRA as my wife is a veterinarian (we still need to register our chooks). We just get lots of alerts regarding new cases and outbreaks, etc so I don't think it's anything to worry about.

since you've been registered a while, can I ask a couple questions?
I think I heard somewhere that registered poultry keepers are supposed to have annual inspections, someone coming to check up on your flock every 12 months
Is this true, and if so what does it entail?

I also read that there's no automatic culling of flocks unless they are tested and are positive for AI. (Obviously the entire flock culled even if only one carries the virus). SO if in a control zone, the most that should happen is a check of your flock and potentially testing- right? There's no random drop ins and culling just for being in the control zone?

My concern is my birds. I detest the amount of unnecessary control, I think its way over the top- there aren't even any cases/control zones currently in the UK.
But I can live with the invasion of my privacy. I can ensure my birds are kept clean of this and that they do not carry AI/test positive. But I need to know that they're not going to be randomly killed by some trigger happy moron just for existing in the same radius as an infected flock.

And I want to know what registering involves, what I need to expect and whether they're going to be coming over here and analysing my birds every year. I only have a handful of ducks for eggs and no links to any other poultry keepers/farms, I don't sell eggs or meat, I'm as basic as a backyard poultry keeper comes.

The mixed replies in this thread have me stressed out and I'd appreciate any clarity that you or anyone else can bring to this discussion.

Kevin

 

[woodworm]

Hi Kevin

We haven't registered our chickens yet (tbh I'd forgotten all about it). My wife is registered due to her being a veterinarian, she gets a fair amount of alerts on all sorts of stuff and I think this is what you're signing up to.

I wish I could say with some authority what DEFRA / APHA would do if you were within a controlled zone in the future - however looking back where there have been outbreaks they don't euthanese every farm within 10km - they apply stricter rules and lockdowns so I don't see any reason why this would be different. These are the rules for the different levels of controlled zones.

IMO there is zero chance of an annual inspection on every poultry keeper - they just don't have the resources to do that. The regulation states an annual review, but that means you have to update the register every 12 months, not that they are coming to see you.

There are lots of scary comments on this thread with valid concerns, however you need to remember that there are people from all over the world on this forum and different countries definitely deal with this differently.

I'm sorry I can't put your mind at ease and I totally agree that some of the rules surrounding poultry are too heavy handed for a backyard poultry keeper.

 

[BackyardinWales]

I only found out about this change 2 hours ago (about 10 pm) and have tried to register, but it seems they were busy and I can't register without them 'confirming my e-mail' which they're not doing.

From what I read it is law if you have over 50 birds, and 'a requirement' otherwise. As it specifies under the heading of 'over 50 birds' you are breaking the law if you do not update your registration.

As a UK resident with only 5 birds, I don't believe I should have to give them my details 'to keep on their database'. I don't need or want their 'notifications', nor their 'alerts'.

Since I don't agree with breaking the law either, I will continue to check, and register if it is necessary.

FYI ... It is now October 1st.

 

[Perris]

I only found out about this change 2 hours ago (about 10 pm) and have tried to register, but it seems they were busy and I can't register without them 'confirming my e-mail' which they're not doing.

From what I read it is law if you have over 50 birds, and 'a requirement' otherwise. As it specifies under the heading of 'over 50 birds' you are breaking the law if you do not update your registration.

As a UK resident with only 5 birds, I don't believe I should have to give them my details 'to keep on their database'. I don't need or want their 'notifications', nor their 'alerts'.

Since I don't agree with breaking the law either, I will continue to check, and register if it is necessary.

FYI ... It is now October 1st.

check your junk / spam email folder. The confirmation email may have gone there. In any case, you do need to register, and you can choose whether or not to get notifications and alerts. Be aware that it was the poultry industry that pushed for this, since they try to scapegoat backyard keepers for their farms going down with Avian Influenza, when it is almost always their staff and their practices that bring it into their densely populated industrial chicken sheds.

 

[BackyardinWales]

check your junk / spam email folder. The confirmation email may have gone there. In any case, you do need to register, and you can choose whether or not to get notifications and alerts. Be aware that it was the poultry industry that pushed for this, since they try to scapegoat backyard keepers for their farms going down with Avian Influenza, when it is almost always their staff and their practices that bring it into their densely populated industrial chicken sheds.

I've been checking my spam folder and mail ... no sign.

 

[EmmaDonovan]

What's the penalty for not registering?