Urgent Advice Needed

[Mimi13]

I’m so sorry for all these losses. I am following to learn more about this. Great info @LaFleche. Thanks.

 

[Vickischics]

There are various possible causes for your chicks dying so young.

A covert salmonella infection of the parent birds/flock. Adult chickens rarely show any symptoms but the chicks hatched of salmonella infected eggs mostly die at about 1-3 weeks of age.

Vitamin deficiency in the parent birds leading to delayed hatch and chicks with clotted/crusted vent and persisting yolk sac.

These are a variety of transferable pathogenic germs/organisms which may be transferred from the mostly inconspiciuous parent birds to the chicks.

So the best would be sending them in to have a necropsy done. This will help in the long run and you will be able to react accordingly.

How in the world do you know this stuff? I started following you ever since you were so helpful with my White Crest Black Polish girl being pecked to near death on Monday evening. Your a plethora of knowledge is crazy good. I'm learning so much.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

But once these chicks he has hatched start getting wing feathers they die-typically within hours of first signs that they aren’t feeling well. They are in with other chicks we didn’t raise and one by one it is only the ones he’s hatching.
What’s going wrong? I have 30 chicks, a turkey, two ducks, and a 30 guineas and the only ones dying are the ones coming from eggs out of his pens and this incubator. TIA!!

They are game birds and parents are on 5way scratch and laying pellets. Chicks will be vigorous until one day they are. Wings down, head dropped, feel bony on the sternum. Just lethargic.

Very sorry for your losses.

What is being fed to the chicks on a regular basis including treats and supplement?

When you say game birds.. you still mean chickens or pheasant/quail type? Please state protein content and amount of both feeds used. The parent feed should effect hatch rate MORE than chick mortality.

Sounds very much like it COULD be coccidiosis.. getting a necropsy on any of them may confirm.

Genetics is ALWAYS suspect.. to me the rarer the breed the smaller the gene pool, the heavier the inbreeding, the less over all vigor.. may be seen AS described including sudden death. I also agree that Salmonella or any other number of causes could be at play. Getting a necropsy should help narrow down the issue.

What are you feeding the parents?
High protein feed if you are hatching their eggs makes a big difference.

Ya, one of the things I USED to claim as well.. NOTING that without listing actual numbers suggesting "high" anything is pointless. For average folks feeding "layer" feed that's 16% protein then 20% would be high. But I already feed 20% protein.. sometimes heading toward 30% protein. There IS a point at which increased protein actually reduces hatch rate.. energy only comes from 3 sources.. fat, protein, and carbohydrates including fiber. *Excessive* protein benefits no one. Folks often tell us eggs or meal worm are great source of protein.. which is true but they leave out the fat content.. eggs are 34% protein and 64% fat. Meal worms sees likewise out of balance numbers.. making them a great nutritious TREAT.. just sharing for informational purposes, not actually directed at you.
https://www.researchgate.net/public...he_Embryo_and_Time_of_Death_During_Incubation

Please note I have hatched hundreds of chicks in styrofoam incubators and never YET had an issue with mortality as described.. To me, the incubator did it's job and if bought brand new is NOT suspect to cause. Which makes it either environmental or genetic..

A link to the state agencies that do the necropolises here in the US..
State poultry labs

Sorry I can't be more help, hope you get some answers!

 

[LaFleche]

How in the world do you know this stuff? I started following you ever since you were so helpful with my White Crest Black Polish girl being pecked to near death on Monday evening. Your a plethora of knowledge is crazy good. I'm learning so much.

You make me blush. It's just accumulated information and experience from more than 20 years of poultry keeping and breeding. And I am still learning.

 

[LaFleche]

Yes, we’ve hatched many a chick just not in this type of incubator. They hatch fine, fluff fine, and then we move them to the brooder. Only one has made it past 3 weeks old! They are game birds and parents are on 5way scratch and laying pellets. Chicks will be vigorous until one day they are. Wings down, head dropped, feel bony on the sternum. Just lethargic. I’m at a loss because I have 25 from cackle the same age just thriving!
and they are from 2 pens of 3 birds each. On grass that rotated often.

If you decide to have a necropsy done on the chicks, you might want to have them tested for:

mycobacterium avium
mycoplasma galliseptum
leucosis
staphylococcus
salmonella

And as your parent birds seem to be quite valuable, you might even consider having a blood sample of each parent bird tested. The samples are to be taken from the blood vessel on the underside of the wings.

Other pathogens like Marek's virus, coccidia oocysts or campylobacter germs do not survive the incubation.

 

[BrookelynCE]

There are various possible causes for your chicks dying so young.

A covert salmonella infection of the parent birds/flock. Adult chickens rarely show any symptoms but the chicks hatched of salmonella infected eggs mostly die at about 1-3 weeks of age.

Vitamin deficiency in the parent birds leading to delayed hatch and chicks with clotted/crusted vent and persisting yolk sac.

There are a variety of transferable pathogenic germs/organisms which may be transferred from the mostly inconspiciuous parent birds to the chicks.

So the best would be sending them in to have a necropsy done. This will help in the long run and you will be able to react accordingly.

Thank you! I work at a vet clinic so that may be the easier route!

 

[BrookelynCE]

What breeds are they? Let's start there. I know some birds have higher chick mortalities, at least in my own experience

Red Quill & Blue Mug Game Fowl

 

[BrookelynCE]

Very sorry for your losses.

What is being fed to the chicks on a regular basis including treats and supplement?

When you say game birds.. you still mean chickens or pheasant/quail type? Please state protein content and amount of both feeds used. The parent feed should effect hatch rate MORE than chick mortality.

Sounds very much like it COULD be coccidiosis.. getting a necropsy on any of them may confirm.

Genetics is ALWAYS suspect.. to me the rarer the breed the smaller the gene pool, the heavier the inbreeding, the less over all vigor.. may be seen AS described including sudden death. I also agree that Salmonella or any other number of causes could be at play. Getting a necropsy should help narrow down the issue.


Ya, one of the things I USED to claim as well.. NOTING that without listing actual numbers suggesting "high" anything is pointless. For average folks feeding "layer" feed that's 16% protein then 20% would be high. But I already feed 20% protein.. sometimes heading toward 30% protein. There IS a point at which increased protein actually reduces hatch rate.. energy only comes from 3 sources.. fat, protein, and carbohydrates including fiber. *Excessive* protein benefits no one. Folks often tell us eggs or meal worm are great source of protein.. which is true but they leave out the fat content.. eggs are 34% protein and 64% fat. Meal worms sees likewise out of balance numbers.. making them a great nutritious TREAT.. just sharing for informational purposes, not actually directed at you.
https://www.researchgate.net/public...he_Embryo_and_Time_of_Death_During_Incubation

Please note I have hatched hundreds of chicks in styrofoam incubators and never YET had an issue with mortality as described.. To me, the incubator did it's job and if bought brand new is NOT suspect to cause. Which makes it either environmental or genetic..

A link to the state agencies that do the necropolises here in the US..
State poultry labs

Sorry I can't be more help, hope you get some answers!

I meant Game Fowl, I’m sorry for the misunderstanding. They are are Red Quill and Blue Mugs. Chicks are on a game bird starter (not chick starter, but higher protein, the same thing we feed the guineas & pheasants.) Parents are on a 22% laying pellet and a typical 5way scratch feed. They get cut squash and zucchini frequently. We have also been very impressed with the little incubator! The numbers have been fantastic. It was bought brand new. I just have got to figure this out or he’s going to give up on something he truly enjoys doing. Thank y’all for the advice!

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Those blues are beautiful. Unfortunately I have no experience yet with game fowl. Do you know how high the protein is for the chick feed?

 

[LaFleche]

Thank you! I work at a vet clinic so that may be the easier route!

So do you have any news on what happened?