Silkied Ameraucana Project

[CatKai]

Silkied Ameraucana are not crossed with the Silkie breed. They are pure Ameraucana with silkied feathers. Silkied is a feather type.

This link below is to the original thread that was started for these birds. That thread was started 10-20-2008 when the 1st pair was 18 weeks old.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/98335/whats-wrong-with-their-feathers

It's a long thread that takes a very long time to go thru to find the info between the chat and all that is in it but it's the best thing to do if you want to know the story from the start. I am starting this new thread in hopes that we can stick to the Silkied Ameraucana project and not attract posts about birds totally unrelated to the project. The title on the original thread isn't specific to what has become a project several are working on now.

Silkied x Silkied = all silkied
Silkied x Split to silkied = split & or silkied
Silkied x non silkied non split = all split
Split x Split = can result in silkied, split and non silkied non split. You can't visually tell the difference between a split and a non split. Test breeding is the only way.

Splash pullet


Splash cockerel


Black pullet


Blue hen


Blue rooster


Blue hen


Blue hen


Splash hen

 

[CatKai]

*I started this before the last few replies were made on the thread. My connection has been on/off today so I may have missed something I should have read but here goes... And no if I did not mention names, I am not going to in the interest of not starting a fight that really would be pointless.*

Yep it happens and didn't take long for it to pop up here. But as much as those people keep up the "slamming", we are still here... Just like those pure Ameraucana winning at shows that pop out that green egg I have heard of and seen, are still called an Ameraucana, these Silkied Ameraucana are going to keep being called Silkied Ameraucana. I don't give a rats rear who doesn't like it... Silkied is a feather type, they have it and they are Ameraucana...

I got eggs early this year from a guy that had Ameraucana he got "directly" from this big name breeder that breeds for showing. The egg color was really bad. I questioned it and was told that some show breeders do not care about the egg color, just the bird. I contacted another Ameraucana breeder and asked about their egg color and heard of coarse they lay blue eggs. If they didn't, they were not Ameraucana. I have had a few from various "top lines" that laid olive or blue-green eggs... All those shades found on the ABC egg color chart used to compare your Ameraucana eggs to.

My take on the Ameraucana - EE thing. I am breeding Ameraucana to Ameraucana not Ameraucana to any other breed. That's an argument that will probably always be around, don't care. Just like those saying it has to lay a blue egg to be called an Ameraucana... I have a pretty Lavender Ameraucana I got from a well known line, hatched from a blue egg and just laid her 1st egg. It's olive green, she's still an Ameraucana. I prefer the blue eggs so won't be using her but she's still the same breed she was before she laid that green egg...

Silkie is a breed. Silkied is a feather type. People will probably always be confused about it. Only thing to do there is explain it.

The original thread was started in Oct. 20, 2008 when the original pair was 18 weeks old, not 2010.

So far, not had any yellow or green legs show up. I did have a few eggs hatch from someone no longer in the project that were green legged and mixed feather colors, not 1 was silkied as advertised though. So sold them as EE's as I could not be sure of their breeding. Who knows what anyone in the beginning may have crossed to in the spirit of adding new blood if that is still showing up for some people. So far, I have not seen it. If I do I'll not be using it to breed forward.

Red bleed on the roo's, I have had some that have it and some that don't. Just like egg color it's something that needs to be worked on. I am not about to go nuts and toss out all my plans because of it. Just like that blue egg I am working on, some lay a blue, blue green and olive. All much better color than the egg color I saw early this year laid by those Ameraucana from a top breeder...

It's not been my experience that these birds are fragile. I have yet to loose 1 bird to any mystery death. I fully expected it to hit but in almost 2 years, it hasn't... Could be any number of reasons for the early losses, related to the genes or not. I treat them like any other chicken I have and they have been healthy and not the least bit fragile. If they were, I'd not still have them and not have so many of them...

I get so many messages about the price of eggs and birds. I have had it suggested to me by more than 1 person, that the price be set high to keep only serious people working on them. Prices in the beginning on these eggs were very high. Auctions were going over $100 alot of times. When I 1st started selling them I priced mine in line with what was already out there. As time has gone buy, I think the high prices are keeping a lot of people out of it that could be helping expand the project. They are either turned off by the high prices or drawn in seeing $ to be made in charging really high prices. No I am not telling anyone what they need to charge, just saying I won't be playing the keep the prices high game...

Breed for what you like and what is important to you. If your goal is showing then go that route and do what you need to do to get there. If egg color matters to you, work on it. If the total package is what you want, work on it. Want the Silkied Ameraucana in a color not out there yet, work on it. It would be great if this thread would be working towards helping those that are interested. Not turn into a thread for people (not pointing anyone out, just in general those against the project) - who feel threatened or whatever by the project to slam (insert whatever word you prefer) the project and try to turn people off of it...

This is a project, may be for a long time. Much work needs to be done. Some people are ahead of others on some points to be improved and not on other points. Some need work on eggs, color, combs - just like any other project...

Anyone working on this Silkied Ameraucana project care to share some pics with the group?

I know some of us are also working on Olive Eggers & Easter Eggers that are silkied. So here is a place to go share those and not have them confused with these Silkied Ameraucana we are working on.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/830332/silkied-olive-egger-easter-egger-projects

 

[CatKai]

But they're still AMs.Why as EEs? Just santeria make sure I don't misrepresent them, but smooths I have hatched out have been close to my BBS straight AM flock. Never heard the EE part.

 

[EdenCamp]

It was one individual. It's that whole non-accepted Ameracauna / EE thing rearing it's head.
On the one hand I understand the ABC being vigilant in protecting the integrity of the breed, I really do.
If somebody was wanting acceptance for Blue RIR's that could be considered out in left field.
But, Ams as a breed are accepted in a few colors now. They are not a one trick (single color identified) pony.
I've never understood the problem refusing to accept splash when Black and Blue are. Crazy.
It appears even staunch ABC folks are pressing for "new" color acceptance - Lav, Choc, Barred, etc.
From a logical perspective, if ABC wants to remain relevant, not fade into relative obscurity with boredom but
generate renewed interest, popularity and passion - excitement even, then they would do well to embrace more variations.
One has only to look at Orpingtons to recognize the implications of a broader color palate.
Many other recognized breeds "get" the value of going forward into new accepted variations while still maintaining the core integrity of the breed.
All "breeds" were at one time projects that "became" through selective breeding efforts.
Ameraucanas are no different.
That Silkieds popped up from a "pure" gene pool is indicative of this.

Absolutely correct that we Silkied folks are not ready to seek acceptance either with ABC or as our own "breed" yet.
2010 when that first pair appeared less than 4 years ago. It's been a challaging effort. Only a handful of second geration breeders have hung in there this far even -
so no, it's impossible for there to be 5 breeders breeding for 5 years yet even with the origional BBS's. Fads flame out quickly, they don't grow.
And while 5 years may be the benchmark to be taken seriously, those dedicated few that have hung in there and made several generations contributions to these birds deserve the utmost respect - it has not been easy. Certainly there are those hot for novelty that will dip in and out - but there are others very serious about developing these birds long term - and the numbers are growing.

Would it be preferable to be accepted under the ABC? Sure. These birds ARE Ameraucanas. Other breeds have accepted variations in color, combs, crests. feather type and been stregthened by doing so rather than splitering off as a seperate breed. It does however remain on the table as an option. And yes, hard feathered "splits" competing with "pure" accepted varieties in shows may go a long ways towards gaining ABC acceptance - or at least a measure of well deserved respected being exhibited. I love the idea.



.

 

[CatKai]

****VARIETY NAME****

OK, there is obviously a LOT of confusion with these birds on the basis that people think they are a cross with Silkies...and the name doesn't help... I've been talking to JerryS on here (Charter Member of the Ameraucana Breeders Club) and he sent me some facts on the discovery of these birds and their feather type:

"The stringy mutation was reported in 1950 and given the st-2 symbol in 1980 according to Poultry Breeding and Genetics by R.D. Crawford . The st mutation was reported in 1945 but all died by 2 weeks of age . So st-2 was given to these that can live to maturity."

So, I'm wondering if the name of this variety should be changed before they become really well known in the chicken world and before I commence my crusade to have them accepted as a new variety by the APA. If so, should we go with Stringy Ameraucana....it's not the best sounding name, I know...but it does hold true to the genetics and separates from the Silkies....or are there other suggestions? St. Ameraucas? They could be a new saint as well as chickens? (just kidding of course!)

 

[EdenCamp]

Not knowing color of your stock - are they all splashes? ... but bringing in good black hard feather stock, both sexes, was a good move. I started with all splits several years ago - so while only 25% of split to split breedings don't carry the silkied gene - you want to either test breed to identify if questionable splits don't carry the gene and remove them from the program or breed them to full silkied so that the offspring will be at least for sure splits. The latter is much easier. So I'm suggesting you continue to breed your questionables to a full silkied.

What you don't want to do is breed questionable splits or even splits to hard feather birds. Just going to end up with a lot more questionable birds that don't carry the gene to sort thru. Way ahead of the game to have known entities.

If it were me, and I had the pens (4+) to dedicate - I'd start putting the 2 silkied girls in with the black cockerel.
In second pen silkied cockerels with black pullet and all but 1 or 2 of the questionable split pullets. Those 2 questionable pullets would go in a third pen with your known split roo. Discard all the questionable cockerels. Origional pen will continue to give you a few full silkieds of both genders. Silkied F and Silkied M will give you offspring containing different line outcross for sure splits but only the Silkied F pen will be fore sure outcrossed unless you can identify the black hens eggs. Replace your origional split roo with the black hen's split cockerel and your hard black roos with a son of his. Keep the split pullets produced in the same pens. The following year you should have full silkied to replace the daddy.. Can introduce a new hard feather roo. Split girls are fine with a silkied roo. Only put the hard feather new roo with full silkied girls.

Are you familiar with the concept of a spiral breeding program? 3 pens plus a bachelor pen to grow out replacement cockerel candidates. The Roos are rotated each year with better sons replacing fathers in rotation but the girls stay in the same pen and are just retired after 2 full years. The difference here is the pullet offspring move over a pen and the roos get replaced from thier own offspring in the same pen except for the hard feather roo in the first pen which is used to bring in fresh blood. Hard roo, silkied pullets and the split pullet offspring go to a full silkied roo and the pullet offspring from the second pen go to the third. The full silkied pullets produced from pen 3 go to the new hard feather or split son of the last hard feather new roo. That's what I'd do anyway. Your mileage may differ.
.

 

[marsha tutterow]

My silkied. Should start laying soon. 12 splash pullets, pair blue, and 3 black split to lavender pullets. And a couple splash Roos in another pen. Should be hatching lots of these guys soon. Also have 4 or more split pullets. Some aren't old enough yet to sex. I will keep those just in case.

 

[dheltzel]

Finally !! 4 eggs incubating now are showing growth. For months, every egg was clear. I think switching roos was helpful, or maybe the improving weather or just the pullets getting older.
Anyway, I'm hoping for some chicks in the next 10 days or so.

This is the roo that I put in that seems to be making it happen. Check out his fluffy beard (maybe that is what impressed the ladies). Maybe his name should be (Saint) Nicholas, lol.

 

[jan12]

Here's a pic of my first one

 

[RaresightFarms]

Is anyone still breeding Silkied Ameraucanas? I had some about 6 years ago, but had to move cross country. Starting up my poultry again, and I'd love to find some starter birds!