Banded Pigeon Found - Assistance Please

[biophiliac]

Pal has given up on her eggs!

In other news, there is thread going on in one of the FB forums in which people are saying to NEVER pat a female dove on her back or even below her head. What say you all?

I believe the theory is that it will stimulate hormonal behavior and put the human in the frame of a mate. I've never had a parrot type bird but having a parrot fixated on you as a mate doesn't seem like a desirable situation. Personally, I don't think it's a big problem with pigeons.

edit - Doves are similar to pigeons but there are many species and I suppose it could be an issue in some species. I doubt it though.

Pal -If you are lucky, without a male to drive her she may not continue to lay regularly.
2nd edit - @Serin may have some advice on this, he can ask Olive what she thinks about petting.

 

[CCUK]

I wonder if it's the same sort of reaction or hormonal thing as chickens when they squat in front of you and you give them a stroke. I've had some of mine go broody by doing that.

 

[Serin]

A lot of folks in the bird community say to avoid it at all costs but I don't follow that line of thought at all. Any single parrot, dove or pigeon kept as a pet will adopt their owner as their mate bond and if you do keep just one bird I think you should be prepared for all that entails, including "mating", which of course just means petting the bird the right way. Parrots are a lot harder to manage than pigeons in this respect, being more complex. It is often suggested that petting a parrots' back will cause hormonal aggression and egg-laying, and the pet bird community is rabidly against encouraging their pets to lay eggs at all. They avoid touchy affection, take away anything that could be seen as a nest site, even keep birds in the dark up to 14 hours a day in summer to try and prevent their birds from expressing their totally natural hormonal behavior. Inevitably, the result is birds that bite, scream, pluck feathers etc and when they do, inevitably, still lay an egg - because you really can't prevent that unless the bird is starved - they are often so stressed and uncomfortable they become egg-bound, cannot pass it, and need emergency medical treatment. It's a vicious cycle.

But if you accept that your bird has needs and is a hormonal animal, I think you can manage it better. If you choose the responsibility of caring for one bird instead of keeping a pair, which is in every birds' best interest ultimately, you shouldn't try to keep it from acting how its meant to act. A bird ultimately wants to breed and my philosophy, rather than denying that at all costs, is to instead make a safe, comfy environment for the bird to do so when it wants. And yes, I do pet my bird when she crouches for me. I'll tread her back with my hand, you don't have to actually touch their naughty bits of course but for birds just firm pressure on the back relieves their hormones.

I do pet Olive on her back, though only if she is persistent about it - I'll normally stay at her head, neck and chest. She does have days where she is really into being mounted and just lays down and raises her tail up and makes her needs very clear sometimes, even if I am only petting her face. I don't always encourage it, but if she is very persistent I will run my fingers along her back and humor her until she's over it, and then she's fine. I chose to bring her into my human environment, so I think it's my responsibility to fulfill the role of the other pigeon she would have bonded to in a natural setting. She is a very well-adjusted, very social and very happy bird. Allowing some release of their hormones, by petting the backs of females and letting males mount their toys (a thing most male parrots will try to do and that shouldn't be discouraged) ultimately limits the negative behavior problems. The thing is all pet birds are hormonal. But in my experience, hormones only translate to lashing out and aggression when they are denied expression of their breeding and nesting behaviors. By accommodating those needs, providing a nutritious diet high in calcium so they lay strong eggs, and giving them a safe place to lay them when they are ready, they really do better. People might not want to have to let their bird sit on her eggs for weeks at a time and not be out playing with them but ultimately, it's just something birds need to do.

Olive hasn't laid yet, I'm not sure if she is young or just not into doing so yet. She has her little fleece bed she sleeps in but she hasn't gotten broody yet. I'm sure she will, and will accommodate her. I even picked up a pair of little wooden eggs, because she often gets so excited jumping up when I greet her in the morning that she knocks her bed onto the floor... and this way, I won't be cleaning up an omelet!

 

[biophiliac]

A lot of folks in the bird community say to avoid it at all costs but I don't follow that line of thought at all. Any single parrot, dove or pigeon kept as a pet will adopt their owner as their mate bond and if you do keep just one bird I think you should be prepared for all that entails, including "mating", which of course just means petting the bird the right way. Parrots are a lot harder to manage than pigeons in this respect, being more complex. It is often suggested that petting a parrots' back will cause hormonal aggression and egg-laying, and the pet bird community is rabidly against encouraging their pets to lay eggs at all. They avoid touchy affection, take away anything that could be seen as a nest site, even keep birds in the dark up to 14 hours a day in summer to try and prevent their birds from expressing their totally natural hormonal behavior. Inevitably, the result is birds that bite, scream, pluck feathers etc and when they do, inevitably, still lay an egg - because you really can't prevent that unless the bird is starved - they are often so stressed and uncomfortable they become egg-bound, cannot pass it, and need emergency medical treatment. It's a vicious cycle.

But if you accept that your bird has needs and is a hormonal animal, I think you can manage it better. If you choose the responsibility of caring for one bird instead of keeping a pair, which is in every birds' best interest ultimately, you shouldn't try to keep it from acting how its meant to act. A bird ultimately wants to breed and my philosophy, rather than denying that at all costs, is to instead make a safe, comfy environment for the bird to do so when it wants. And yes, I do pet my bird when she crouches for me. I'll tread her back with my hand, you don't have to actually touch their naughty bits of course but for birds just firm pressure on the back relieves their hormones.

I do pet Olive on her back, though only if she is persistent about it - I'll normally stay at her head, neck and chest. She does have days where she is really into being mounted and just lays down and raises her tail up and makes her needs very clear sometimes, even if I am only petting her face. I don't always encourage it, but if she is very persistent I will run my fingers along her back and humor her until she's over it, and then she's fine. I chose to bring her into my human environment, so I think it's my responsibility to fulfill the role of the other pigeon she would have bonded to in a natural setting. She is a very well-adjusted, very social and very happy bird. Allowing some release of their hormones, by petting the backs of females and letting males mount their toys (a thing most male parrots will try to do and that shouldn't be discouraged) ultimately limits the negative behavior problems. The thing is all pet birds are hormonal. But in my experience, hormones only translate to lashing out and aggression when they are denied expression of their breeding and nesting behaviors. By accommodating those needs, providing a nutritious diet high in calcium so they lay strong eggs, and giving them a safe place to lay them when they are ready, they really do better. People might not want to have to let their bird sit on her eggs for weeks at a time and not be out playing with them but ultimately, it's just something birds need to do.

Olive hasn't laid yet, I'm not sure if she is young or just not into doing so yet. She has her little fleece bed she sleeps in but she hasn't gotten broody yet. I'm sure she will, and will accommodate her. I even picked up a pair of little wooden eggs, because she often gets so excited jumping up when I greet her in the morning that she knocks her bed onto the floor... and this way, I won't be cleaning up an omelet!

 

[3bird]

I believe the theory is that it will stimulate hormonal behavior and put the human in the frame of a mate. I've never had a parrot type bird but having a parrot fixated on you as a mate doesn't seem like a desirable situation. Personally, I don't think it's a big problem with pigeons.

edit - Doves are similar to pigeons but there are many species and I suppose it could be an issue in some species. I doubt it though.

Pal -If you are lucky, without a male to drive her she may not continue to lay regularly.
2nd edit - @Serin may have some advice on this, he can ask Olive what she thinks about petting.

Thanks. After several days off the nest and out all day, Pal is back working on the nest and was sitting on it this morning. :-( I'll let you know.

Here was the discussion of patting birds on their backs:

And here is an article that was cited:

https://mickaboo.org/resources/disc...o3FLZ_3DNZ6eusJE4cMBpMOB9umuUtsIT6BRRQ1TAPxFU

 

[biophiliac]

Although I respect the work of Mickaboo.org, neither the article nor the fb discussion persuades me that petting pigeons is a problem. I'm siding with Servin on this.

Individuals differ so if you feel petting is encouraging aggression or compulsive behavior in a bird -reconsider.

 

[3bird]

Although I respect the work of Mickaboo.org, neither the article nor the fb discussion persuades me that petting pigeons is a problem. I'm siding with Servin on this.

Individuals differ so if you feel petting is encouraging aggression or compulsive behavior in a bird -reconsider.

I'm fully with you and @Serin here. We just didn't want to be increasing the frequency with which either lays eggs. Overall, they both seems content and affectionate--though more with us than each other often! Pen LOVES her pats, and Pal appreciates some more subdued scratches. When I come in the room, Pen immediately wants to be on my head or shoulder and wants pats. Recently Pal has been coming too...both trying to land on my head together...lol. We adore these birds.

 

[biophiliac]

rying to land on my head together...lol. We adore these birds.

 

[WVduckchick]

That’s all new to me, the petting stuff. Thanks for bringing it up.

Great pic @biophiliac !!

 

[3bird]

UPDATE: As of today, Pal is sitting one two new eggs. We got a second nest for Pen, and she is using it, but she has not laid and happily comes out to play, cuddle, fly, etc. Pal on the other hand is out for the broody poop, picks up something for the nest and returns to it.