Barnevelder breeders lets work together and improve the breed

[GwenDellAnno]

My pullets were hatched at the beginning of May last year and started laying somewhere around Christmas..... in spite of cold, snow and low light levels. They have continued to lay right through. They are slowing down some now due to molt, but not completely stopping. I'm hoping that it will pick up again soon. We'll see.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

Quote:
this gives me hope!! thanks!

 

[CityChicker]

Hey Everyone!

I thought I would snap a couple pictures of my newly hatched Barnevelders while I was cleaning their brooder. Excuse the quality as I took them with my cell phone. These are the chicks that hatched from eggs I got from Paul's Poultry. I think in the second picture you might be able to see the colors better. As I said, I think 2 definitely look more like Welsummers and one looks sort of like both a Welsummer and a Barnevelder, so probably a cross as well. The other 3 look like Barnevelders (obviously though I know they may very well not be pure).

I hatched one from Gabbard's eggs last week as well, but ended up having to cull it. I haven't talked about it much, but decided I would mention it on the board. The eggs from Gabbard's varied radically in size and color. Only one of the smaller eggs out of 2 dozen even developed. The chick hatched and was in no way, shape, or form a Barnevelder. It was some sort of solid dark red bantam. It also was very, very weak with one swollen closed eye and the other eye appearing to be blind. I held on to it for longer than I normally would, but eventually culled it as it seemed like it wasn't eating or drinking at all and appeared to be suffering (cried continuously day and night and never left its' little corner of the brooder or joined the other chicks). At any rate, it was obvious it was not even a Barnevelder.

Anyway, here are the Paul's Poultry chicks...

 

[annie3001]

heres our boy!

 

[()relics]

Quote:
....they look really light in the head and neck to me...You could email the person you got them from and ask if they were all from the same brood stock, not that they would tell you the truth. If they all have the same parentage I think I would cull all of them and tell the seller you want a full refund because you obviously got the wrong eggs, unless you bought barnevelder Xs....I am afraid, as I have said before in other posts, that using anything but a REALLY true barnevelder may disappoint you down the road by not breeding AT ALL the the standard.

Quote:
another good move on your part....Just curious: did you buy standards or bantams? I have heard of others getting various egg types/colors/sizes but most of them didn't hatch anyway so the chicks couldn't be compared to each other...

sorry for you, as it seems that you have been the victim of unscrupulous breeders and profiteers.


annie3001...I hope you haven't fallen into the same trap...thats is definetly not a Barnevelder...He is Way Too Red...and appears to have a rose comb, and slate colored legs ? Looks alot like a welsummer X something else, rooster to me, but maybe its the camera playing tricks...JMO

 

[CityChicker]

I agree with what you are saying, relics. I will probably just keep the hens for my utility layer flock. The Gabbard experience was negative all the way around. I have spoken to a couple people about it, but didn't know whether or not I would post about it here, but I want to save other people the headache. I have now of course, after the fact, seen numerous similar complaints. I bought 2 dozen eggs from her at a really hefty penny at that. They arrived actually in great condition with intact air cells. That was about the only positive.

She included ONE extra egg, which to me is cheap beyond belief. I always include at least a few (or more) for every dozen (and honestly, that is typical for how people in the poultry hobby *used* to do business, some still do). Anyway, my first clue something was off was that the eggs varied so drastically in size and color. That, to me, indicates a real lack of selection on the part of the breeder. Some were tiny, tiny little off-white eggs. Others were medium sized light-to-medium brown eggs and basically several sizes and colors in between the two. None of them had even remotely decent color. Out of all of those eggs, only one even developed at all. Now, I know all the risks of shipped eggs. I have been doing this for over 25 years. That said, it is very uncommon for fertile eggs to arrive in good shape with intact air cells and have only 1 out of 2 dozen even begin development. Again, that makes me seriously question her husbandry practices and the vigor of her adult stock.

The one chick that hatched (BTW- the eggs from Paul's were in the same incubator and almost all developed and hatched) was so small and weak. Again, that was really another big strike against them as far as I'm concerned. The vastly different eggs, the almost total lack of development (or fertility), and the scrawny, sickly little chick that didn't resemble a Barnevelder all combined makes me seriously question their husbandry practices and the quality of their breeding stock. Just the egg color and size alone shows me that they are not selecting for anything in particular other than eggs, LOL (and yes, they were all supposed to be large fowl). Never again. I won't be ordering from them any time in the foreseeable future.

I really think that a lot of the problem is that Barnevelders are simply a breed that needs work almost like none other in the US. That said, we won't get anywhere without rigorous culling. I have done this many years and I still have to remind myself of that on occasions like this when so few birds are available and /or even half way decent quality.

 

[tnchickenut]

Quote:
Just shows that you can't judge abook by it's cover or a breeder by their webpage. Sure is pretty though, ain't it?

Did I read you say "Almost white"!?!?! No WAY that is from a barnie.

And you are right. If you cull everyone you won't have much to work with...

I have a somewhat radical idea... what if we (as a nation of breeders not BYC) formed some sort of fund to import stock from Europe? The problem to work out then would be who gets the birds when they get here... but maybe there could be a vote, or a sharing program, or some contract that eggs be shared evenly with contrbutors. that way it is all about the betterment of the breed, and not pure profit from one farm... like greenfire, for example.

 

[tnchickenut]

Forgot to mention... I agree with relic... that boy is too red He is pretty, but not for breeding.

 

[CityChicker]

Yes, their website certainly is nice and flashy, isn't it? LOL

I have actually thought about importing eggs. I have seen breeders do breeding consortiums before and do just that, but with other types of birds, not poultry. I don't think it has been done with poultry, but it certainly could be. I know that importing eggs is *much* easier than importing live birds, but you do have the added issue of having to import large volume to get enough viable breeders. One thing that is difficult as well is finding a breeder in the UK to work with you in getting the necessary testing done. I have mostly looked at importing from the UK, but not Barnevelders specifically, perhaps they would be better found somewhere else. Anyway, it is something to think about for the future.

 

[()relics]

OK here we go. These are some of my birds, nothing particular just stuff I had seperated so they were the easist to snap a few shots.
1st: a young pair of bantam Barnevelders. They were hatched in march and the pullet hasn't started to lay yet but she is close.

2nd: the same pair as above but I threw a standard cockerel in with them just for a size comparison, he was hatched in May...hard to see but you get the idea. His comb isn't the best so I am not using him for breeding, he is one of the birds that I am trying to find a new home for.

3rde above cockerel and pullet in my hand. For the overhead view and for size comparison, to a human hand.

4th: the above pullet's wing spread. I expect her to look a little better after she molts next spring....I said " I Hope"

These are 3 of MY birds. They breed true and have no outcrooses in them. They are by no means perfect but at least they are all barnevelder. The standard size birds are true to standard for size color and type. The hens lay a fairly uniform color and size egg. The Bantams experimental, at best. They are true to the standard standard except for size. They are not consistent layers and are slow to start egg production, but they are a work in progress. Let me add...you don't see much/any red in the cockerels, so when I comment on other peoples birds and say they have alot of red, I am just comparing them to mine.