Can a Swan & Goose interbreed ?

[chickenzoo]

You would think someone would have. It's somewhat confusing......

 

[FireTigeris]

The problem is they are in the same Order, but different Genus, it would be like testing human DNA to a Bonobo or Chimpanzee there would be very little to tell someone who was who.

Sex chromosomes are easy kids do that in high school, DNA mapping is complex.

Now how many chromosomes they have might tell a tale, like Horses vs Donkeys vs mules...

Most hybrids (in the same Genus, different genus is still not known to happen in the upper animal kingdom, (reptiles, mammals, birds)) have an odd number of chromosomes because the parents have different numbers of chromosomes, and one parent passes on one that doesn't pair up...

So that would be a way to tell- you would need blood or... really skin or blood for the best results.

ALL geese -should- have the same number, all swans, all ducks, each group would have its own number so if the two groups mixed the russulting offspring would have the 'average' of the two parents (rounded up to the nearest whole number).

(EDIT: tail/tale, *shrug*)

 

[franklinstreetwest]

Ok so maybe the DNA testing that others were refering to on BYC in regard to emu and ostrich and the like were less than specific about how extensive the testing was. But there is still comprehensive DNA testing available to the general public (for a "reasonable" price) not to mention, scientifically if it were plausible it would seem that someone would be interested enough to run the labs on it. As a matter of a fact, you can have your own genome fully sequenced these days (much more in depth than simple DNA sequencing), and that will tell a person more than they ever wanted to know about a specific individual organism (again for a price but a MUCH bigger one). I guess I will leave this mystery to the realms of my imagination and be happy with that.....just like I'm happy making up stories about how squirrels mutate to pure wheat golden color.....fun to think about.

 

[texascowboy1979]

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I concure, I think that if they have the will... they will find a way. Have hope... Im just saying.. *hug*

 

[FireTigeris]

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The main problem is they would have to have pure samples of the DNA -AND- have already sequenced the two "parent" types, for such a rare natural occurrence (if indeed this bird -is natural and not AI- then escaped or dumped) I don't think any of the labs around have that just 'on file' they just got done with doggy DNAs and kitty DNA's (including the small wild types - for legal reasons Wild parents and F1's of particular cat crosses are illegal w/o permit in some areas/states.

 

[franklinstreetwest]

Just got done with dog and cat DNA or done mapping the cat and dog Genome?

 

[FireTigeris]

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Well for the cats, its just a matter of counting the number of chromosomes, not the full genome- the domsetic cat has 38 and the f1 Bengal cats have either 37 or 38- the ones with 38 maintain the size of the 'wild' ancestor and both sexes are fertile, the 37 chromosome cats the males are often (but not always sterile) and the F2 from them are the size of standard domestic cats.



Dog Genome Mapped:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/genome/guide/dog/

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/12/1207_051207_dog_genome.html

http://www.broadinstitute.org/mammals/dog

So 'finished' might have been misleading, I apologize.

 

[Chickndaddy]

A Jurassic Park quote seems relevant here:

"Life, uh... finds a way."

- Ian Malcolm (Jeff Goldblum)

That article was pretty interesting. A black Sebbie would be pretty...

 

[Speceider]

You might want to take a look at:

Johnsgard, P.A. 1960. hybridization in the Anatidae and its taxonomic implications. Condor 62:25-33.

Paul has done more work on waterfowl hybridization than anyone else. He lists black swans, mutes, whoppers, and whistling swans as having hybridized with greylags in captivity, although fertility isn't mentioned. He lists mutes as having hybridized with swan geese.

You might also want to check the listings in gray (1958) Avian Hybrids.

Also, you can search http://www.bird-hybrids.com/engine....e&nomenclature=cinfosci&family=cinfosubfameng for references.

Waterfowl (and most bird) chromosomes are very different from mammalian chromosomes, and as a result, our definition of "species" and what schools teach as "rules" are often broken.

Clint

 

[FireTigeris]

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True everything is based on mammals first even though the mammals have the most ridged rules.

Also the 'species' groupings are not DNA based yet, based on looks and of behavior.