Observations on Mottling and its many allelic mutations

nicalandia

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Due to recent genetic mapping of the mottling allele(Endothelin Receptor B2 or EDNRB2 ) research have been able to identify at least four allelic mutations of the recessive mottling gene,

Research work by Japanese team: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0086361 responsible for two mutation confirmation(mo^w and mo^j)

Research work by Blacksburg, Virginia Team: https://vtechworks.lib.vt.edu/bitstream/handle/10919/85397/Li_J_D_2017.pdf responsible for two mutations(mo/mo and mo^d/mo^d)

mo^w/mo^w = Breed: White Minohik - The most extreme of recessive mottling mutations, a solid white bird: Cys244Phe amino acid substitution in EDNRB2( the researchers have given the mutation the official nomenclature of mo^w so this take precedence over any other claims)

mo^j/m^j = Breeds: Mottled/Exchequer Japanese Chabo and in Mottled Japanese breeds Pekins: Arg332His amino acid substitution in EDNRB2(no official designation was given to the mutation by the research at thet time so I propose mo^j/mo^j for Japanese mottling)

mo/mo = recessive Mottling(breeds sequenced: Houdan, Speckled Sussex, Spangled OEG): Ala228Thr amino acid substitution in EDNRB2

mo^d/mo^d = Breed: Mille Fleur and Black Mottled D'uccle, the research found that no mutation was present and it was identical to the wildtype Mo+ allele, but they went ahead and speculated that it may be a different mutation on the EDNRB2 but on a non-coding region. non-coding DNA is often incorrectly referredjunk DNA (no official designation has been given to the mutation so I propose mo^d/mo^d for D'uccle)


mo^w Chick down: White Minohik
mow.jpg



mo^j chick down: Mottled Japanses Chabo



mo chick down: mottled OEG




mo^d chick down: Black Mottled D'uccle:







Of all of the chick down the one that is the least affected by mottling is the Mottled D'uccle, The black/blue mottled D'uccle hatch just like regular black ones and with time they start showing their mottling, this is due to the fact that their mottling mutation is identical to Mo+(wildtype) on the encoding region of the allele.
 
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Cyprus

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So if they determined that the mottling in d'Uccles is the same as the already established wildtype mottling, then why did they just 'decide' that it had to be something different? I would have supposed it to be the same as the wildtype mottling if that's what research determined.
Did they take into account the Japanese Bantam ancestry of the d'Uccle breed?
 

nicalandia

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Did they take into account the Japanese Bantam ancestry of the d'Uccle breed?
The research work done where Japanese mottling was found and the one where D'uccle genetic was mapped were different from each other, the research studying D'uccle did not test any Japanese mottled breed just European breeds and due to the genetic difference between Japanese mottling(mo^j) and D'uccle mottling(m^d) I believe that Japanese mottling did not contribute to the mottling in D'uccles

So if they determined that the mottling in d'Uccles is the same as the already established wildtype mottling, then why did they just 'decide' that it had to be something different?
Due to the remarkable resemblance to mottling, remember that all they did was test the encoding region for any type of mutations in EDNRB2 allele, they did not find any in D'uccles so that makes them technically Mo+(the chick down would suggest so) but it's not taking into account any non-coding mutation region that may affect an inhibiting effect on the EDNRB2 allele and that could lead the mottling appearance.



While not entirely improbably that its just a different mutation all together.

Just look at these birds, they are mo/mo^d the hen looks partially mottled, but the male less so(if you don't pay much attention to the throat mottling)

Last spring I bred a bantam mottled cochin rooster to a bantam mille fleur d'uccle hen. The babies were absolutely adorable. Here is a picture of one of the roosters and one of the hens out of the cross.

We need help from people with these breeds to do test breeding and report back their findings.
 
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Amer

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The research work done where Japanese mottling was found and the one where D'uccle genetic was mapped were different from each other, the research studying D'uccle did not test any Japanese mottled breed just European breeds and due to the genetic difference between Japanese mottling(mo^j) and D'uccle mottling(m^d) I believe that Japanese mottling did not contribute to the mottling in D'uccles

Due to the remarkable resemblance to mottling, remember that all they did was test the encoding region for any type of mutations in EDNRB2 allele, they did not find any in D'uccles so that makes them technically Mo+(the chick down would suggest so) but it's not taking into account any non-coding mutation region that may affect an inhibiting effect on the EDNRB2 allele and that could lead the mottling appearance.



While not entirely improbably that its just a different mutation all together.

Just look at these birds, they are mo/mo^d the hen looks partially mottled, but the male less so(if you don't pay much attention to the throat mottling)




We need help from people with these breeds to do test breeding and report back their findings.
Would mottling in d’Anvers and d’Uccles be the same? Maybe a separate mutation in the Belgian breeds possibly before the d’Uccle existed? Since all Belgian breeds have the same pattern? I would have thought Belgian mottling existed before instead of being crossed into each and every Belgian breed.
 

nicalandia

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Would mottling in d’Anvers and d’Uccles be the same? Maybe a separate mutation in the Belgian breeds possibly before the d’Uccle existed? Since all Belgian breeds have the same pattern? I would have thought Belgian mottling existed before instead of being crossed into each and every Belgian breed.
They should be the same mottling mutation, but I haven't had luck finding pics of the chick down of black mottled d’Anvers, chick down that seem identical to solid black d’Anvers will the give away.

Now interesting fact.

The Black mottled Japanese Pekin have the Japanese type mottling mutation(mo^j near solid white bird with black markings on the back of the head), but American type Bantam Cochins have the normal mottling mutation, so many breeds that have recently incorporated the black mottling pattern simultaneously in different continents will usually use the locally available mottling mutation so mottled breeds in Japan are Japanese mottled, the same breed being worked in Europe will have the normal or widely known mutation that was found in European mottled breeds(Houdan, Sussex, OEG) So chances are that if there was a larger DNA pool around the world we will find more mutations and what we know are recessive mottling(Ala228Thr amino acid substitution) Will be renamed mo^e for European type mottling.

Black Japanese Cochin/Pekin and Japanese Mottled Cochin/Penkin hens with chick down

Japanese Mottling1.jpg
 
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Amer

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They should be the same mottling mutation, but I haven't had luck finding pics of the chick down of black mottled d’Anvers, chick down that seem identical to solid black d’Anvers will the give away.

Now interesting fact.

The Black mottled Japanese Peking have the Japanese type mottling mutation(mo^j near solid white bird with black markings on the back of the head), but American type Bantam Cochins have the normal mottling mutation, so many breeds that have recently incorporated the black mottling pattern simultaneously in different continents will usually use the locally available mottling mutation so mottled breeds in Japan are Japanese mottled, the same breed being worked in Europe will have the normal or widely known mutation that was found in European mottled breeds(Houdan, Sussex, OEG) So chances are that if there was a larger DNA pool around the world we will find more mutations and what we know are recessive mottling(Ala228Thr amino acid substitution) Will be renamed mo^e for European type mottling.
Interesting.
 

nicalandia

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Interesting.
Just edited the post with Japanese Mottled Cochin/Pekin info.


While mottling can have varying effect as adult, the effect it has on Extended Black chick down cant be changed, so we can easily identify the Japanese mottling mutation from the European type mutation, the lack of any effect would indicate d’uccle mutation, that is why I believe that the White Crest in WC Black Polish has a type of mottling mutation due to its effect on chick down.
 
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Cyprus

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Just edited the post with Japanese Mottled Cochin/Pekin info.


While mottling can have varying effect as adult, the effect it has on Extended Black chick down cant be changed, so we can easily identify the Japanese mottling mutation from the European type mutation, the lack of any effect would indicate d’uccle mutation, that is why I believe that the White Crest in WC Black Polish has a type of mottling mutation due to its effect on chick down.
What do you have to say about this chick that came from two mottled parents? The majority of the chicks from this pairing looked like the Japanese mottled down. Both parents had japanese mottled down.

20190813_083347.jpg
 

nicalandia

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What do you have to say about this chick that came from two mottled parents? The majority of the chicks from this pairing looked like the Japanese mottled down. Both parents had japanese mottled down
is he the only one that has hatched like that? perhaps he is mo/mo and both parents are mo^j/mo? Perhaps he is the only one that will ever hatch like that.
 

Cyprus

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is he the only one that has hatched like that? perhaps he is mo/mo and both parents are mo^j/mo? Perhaps he is the only one that will ever hatch like that.
Yup. Only chick hatched like this. Mottled Japanese parents. Dad hatched from a line that only throws mo^j/mo^j mom was phenotypically mo^j/mo^j. Other female that I got with her is genetically proven to be mo^j/mo. But that female was broody and none of her eggs were hatched this brood.
 
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