Protein Content

[Dead Rabbit]

Every oat I've ever fed was 8-12% protein. There is a hulless variety that has much higher nutrition value, but I've never even seen these much less fed them.
Fermenting grains up their nutrition value not lower them. But I quite fermenting oats 10 yrs ago. I found just soaking them did just as well and it weakened the hull for digestion. Weakening hulls don't devalue oats because poultry don't need fiber like other living beings.

I do not ferment their pellets. I never personally saw the value in it, much less the miracle results some claim on the ol' inter web. But at times I would soak their pellets till they soften. This was generally in the heat of summer or bitter cold when moisture consumption was of high priority

 

[Ridgerunner]

Yes, Cindy, you get that a lot. I think corn is the component that gets trashed the most. You get different values depending on which corn it is and which stage it is in (milk through dried). As RonP said, most of the stuff stated on this thread is opinion so I’ll put this in to show some of those nutritional values. The protein content of corn is lower than most other grains but it is certainly not void. And nutrition is not just protein. People often get tunnel vision about that. According to this video from Auburn the egg yolk is about 1/3 fat. There is a good reason corn is a major part of a lot of animal feed. You might enjoy this video, I learned some stuff from it.

How an egg is made utube

Nutrition Facts Corn, white

Amount Per 100 grams

Calories 606

% Daily Value*
Total Fat 8 g 12%
Saturated fat 1.1 g 5%
Polyunsaturated fat 3.6 g
Monounsaturated fat 2.1 g
Cholesterol 0 mg 0%
Sodium 58 mg 2%
Potassium 476 mg 13%
Total Carbohydrate 123 g 41%

Protein 16 g 32%

Vitamin A 0% Vitamin C 0%
Calcium 1% Iron 25%
Vitamin D 0% Vitamin B-6 50%
Vitamin B-12 0% Magnesium 52%

Sir the main reason corn is used so heavily in animal feeds and now human foods is because it's cheap. Easy to produce,. Readily available. And easy to "transform" into other ingenious products.
There is value to corn. Whole dent corn, or even more so other types of corn. But it's over fed. Mainly because of the above stated reason

Yes it is fairly inexpensive to produce. I don't know that to be a crime. I kind of like keeping the cost of feed down as long as the nutrients are there. When mixed in the proper ratios with other nutrients it makes a balanced feed. I certainly agree that the balanced feed is all they need. Corn is often a component of that balanced feed.

I don't feed mine scratch either. MIne get a Grower or Starter with oyster shell on the side. The percent protein in the feed is anywhere between 15% to 20%, whatever is appropriate for any chicks with the flock at that point. They also forage, get kitchen wastes, get stuff from the garden in season, and when my trapping is successful or I butcher they get fresh animal products. I don’t try to micromanage their nutrient intake but I think they eat fairly well. They are healthy, active, most of their eggs hatch when incubated (usually), and they taste great when I cook them.

I think where we most disagree is when you say “Scratch is mostly garbage and empty calories”. When I look at the nutrient content and the nutrient requirements I see beneficial nutrients. That’s why I posted that, so people can see for themselves what those nutrients are in a major component of most scratch instead of just hearing negative opinions. As long as it is a minor part of what they eat it’s not going to upset their balanced diet any more than my kitchen wastes, stuff for the garden or anything else I give them. I personally see no reason to be so negative about scratch.

 

[Dead Rabbit]

Yes it is fairly inexpensive to produce. I don't know that to be a crime. I kind of like keeping the cost of feed down as long as the nutrients are there. When mixed in the proper ratios with other nutrients it makes a balanced feed. I certainly agree that the balanced feed is all they need. Corn is often a component of that balanced feed.

I don't feed mine scratch either. MIne get a Grower or Starter with oyster shell on the side. The percent protein in the feed is anywhere between 15% to 20%, whatever is appropriate for any chicks with the flock at that point. They also forage, get kitchen wastes, get stuff from the garden in season, and when my trapping is successful or I butcher they get fresh animal products. I don’t try to micromanage their nutrient intake but I think they eat fairly well. They are healthy, active, most of their eggs hatch when incubated (usually), and they taste great when I cook them.

I think where we most disagree is when you say “Scratch is mostly garbage and empty calories”. When I look at the nutrient content and the nutrient requirements I see beneficial nutrients. That’s why I posted that, so people can see for themselves what those nutrients are in a major component of most scratch instead of just hearing negative opinions. As long as it is a minor part of what they eat it’s not going to upset their balanced diet any more than my kitchen wastes, stuff for the garden or anything else I give them. I personally see no reason to be so negative about scratch.

The value is in whole corn. But.......For a layer Fock a high calorie food means nothing more than fat. Unused calories convert to fat. Layers won't burn off enough calories to stay in top shape. Hence the fat found on 3-4 yr old layers. Fat is not only unhealthy but can cut down on production and fertility.

The problem is, most folks have not had fowl for more than 4-5 yrs. and few have actually had them a decade or more. Even fewer will ever try different feeding techniques to prove or disprove one method or another. So they keep a 15-18% layer/breeder ration in front of their birds which is great. But they then feed scratch or corn by the handfuls which has little true nutrition in comparison to ration. But it gets worse, Doing so cuts down on the nutrition of the ration. Without even realizing they have fat poor layer flocks.
And this comes from traditional ways of feeding which is promoted by the masses. There is so much better out there than traditional scratch....remember, even a snickers bar has some nutrition to it. But.....well you know.

 

[MeepBeep]

Every oat I've ever fed was 8-12% protein. There is a hulless variety that has much higher nutrition value, but I've never even seen these much less fed them.

Full oat seeds is what I get from the local farmers or feed store, hull and all for $8 a 50lb bag, and as I said it's 16-17% protein...

Processed oats like rolled oats, cut oats or oat groats have been cooked and/or oxidized lowering their nutritional profile... But even so regular rolled oats is about 13-14% protein...

Fermenting grains up their nutrition value not lower them.

Yes, it does increase the total amount of protein in the end, but not initially as a percentage of the mixture...

If you take 1 lb of 16% feed that is 0.16 lbs of protein, if you add 1 lb water you now have 2lbs of feed combined with that same 0.16lbs of protein or a combined 8% protein feed now... At the end of the fermentation you should have more than 0.16 lbs of protein but to get a 1:1 measurement of the actual increase in percentage after fermentation you need to remove the water and remeasure and that is beyond the ability of most of us...

 

[rsweet]

I gotta ask to everyone who has posted on this topic do you approach your own diet with the passion you do for your chickens? It's not a loaded question but being new to owning some gals who I gotta say I've become quite attached to, I thought I would inquire. Don't get me wrong my diet is not high on my list. But the passion is undeniable.
Thanks

 

[Dead Rabbit]

I gotta ask to everyone who has posted on this topic do you approach your own diet with the passion you do for your chickens? It's not a loaded question but being new to owning some gals who I gotta say I've become quite attached to, I thought I would inquire. Don't get me wrong my diet is not high on my list. But the passion is undeniable.
Thanks

NOOOOOOOO!!!! Lol.

But my serious feeding methods are from times past. I transitioned to layers only and even quit seriously raising bantams 5 yrs ago. So my feeding methods greatly simplified. Before that feeding was a detailed science. I could enjoy my fowl a lot more with out sweating the details so much.

 

[MeepBeep]

.For a layer Fock a high calorie food means nothing more than fat. Unused calories convert to fat. Layers won't burn off enough calories to stay in top shape. Hence the fat found on 3-4 yr old layers. Fat is not only unhealthy but can cut down on production and fertility.

As part of the evolutionary path most birds eat based on 'at the moment' calorie needs, in general they don't 'over eat' or even eat planning any further ahead then their nightly roost, they spend every day eating for that days needs with little extra converted to fat in the end... The exception would be modern day broilers where selective breeding has turned off that internal calorie limiter... This is why even a few hours without food can cause cause a decrease in egg production,and a few days without food can cause health issue for many birds, birds in general simply don't store much fat, there bodies are designed for a constant food supply entering... Since they only eat what they need at that moment there is generally very little stored as fat, although as you said over they years it can accumulate to some degree but it's a slow process in most birds and generally only happens when they are confined and inactive or a resulted of selective breeding...

 

[Dead Rabbit]

Full oat seeds is what I get from the local farmers or feed store, hull and all for $8 a 50lb bag, and as I said it's 16-17% protein...

Processed oats like rolled oats, cut oats or oat groats have been cooked and/or oxidized lowering their nutritional profile... But even so regular rolled oats is about 13-14% protein...
Yes, it does increase the total amount of protein in the end, but not initially as a percentage of the mixture...

If you take 1 lb of 16% feed that is 0.16 lbs of protein, if you add 1 lb water you now have 2lbs of feed combined with that same 0.16lbs of protein or a combined 8% protein feed now... At the end of the fermentation you should have more than 0.16 lbs of protein but to get a 1:1 measurement of the actual increase in percentage after fermentation you need to remove the water and remeasure and that is beyond the ability of most of us...

When I was serious about feeding, I sure would have loved to find them high protein oats. Only oats I ever fed were racehorse oats. Whole oats. Not steamed, crimped, rolled. I believe in keeping the germ intact. I believe the labels read 8-12% depending on brand and location purchased

 

[MeepBeep]

I gotta ask to everyone who has posted on this topic do you approach your own diet with the passion you do for your chickens?

Yes, I try to eat a balanced diet that provides myself with sufficient levels of nutrients and protein so that I healthy and active...

And like most people I do 'splurge' in moderation with less nutritious foods, but so do my birds on occasion... But overall and at the end of the day, I try to feed a nutritionally balanced diet to my family and all my pets...

 

[Dead Rabbit]

As part of the evolutionary path most birds eat based on 'at the moment' calorie needs, in general they don't 'over eat' or even eat planning any further ahead then their nightly roost, they spend every day eating for that days needs with little extra converted to fat in the end... The exception would be modern day broilers where selective breeding has turned off that internal calorie limiter... This is why even a few hours without food can cause cause a decrease in egg production,and a few days without food can cause health issue for many birds, birds in general simply don't store much fat, there bodies are designed for a constant food supply entering... Since they only eat what they need at that moment there is generally very little stored as fat, although as you said over they years it can accumulate to some degree but it's a slow process in most birds and generally only happens when they are confined and inactive or a resulted of selective breeding...

Sorry I don't go for that "eating based on a caloric need" statement. I've read that here on this site numerous times but experience I've seen speaks otherwise

I Definitly don't go for that "evolutionary path" statement