Update, Necropsy Results

[DwayneNLiz]

and just to reiterate this is not an attack @flwrldy just constructive criticism toward the feed you were doing the right thing, feeding the right stuff, and i LOVE that you had the necropsy done!!!

 

[Granny Hatchet]

I use 17% layer pellets which my chickens take well. I notice the feed the OP is using has oat groves and seeds whole. My chickens will leave oat groves behind whenever they get the occasional treat of 5 way scratch grains. So, I would also probably switch to a layer pellet or crumble that has everything homogenized into each bite, just to keep them from selectively eating or any waste. Pam--Granny Hatchet, we all love you for your helpful comments and good humor.

Thank you !

 

[Stayc]

Sorry for your loss

 

[Folly's place]

I'm going to mention that it's well known that pet birds and pet rodents will pick out the 'good stuff' from a seed blend type feed, and develop fatty liver as a result. That's why I feed a pelleted or crumble feed, so all the nutrients are spread though the feed, and there's no way an individual can eat mostly one item.
I like Flock Raiser, with oyster shell on the side, for my birds.
Mary

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Scratch and Peck Layer Feed (5% cracked corn added for winter months)

Chickens use calories for energy to keep themselves warm. Corn does NOT keep a chicken warm. If they need more energy they COULD eat more of their BALANCED feed. But you offer me a bag of chips and I'll take it every time refardless of the nutrients inside. In other words they will eat to meet their energy need and not their nutrient need. Yes some days will be more and others less, often relative to the weather.

1/8-1/4 cup scratch (amount depends on the day and their ability to free range)

That doesn't seem to much depending on how many birds.

But it's added to the already 5% added cracked corn that's mixed with your layer.

3/4 - 1 cup Grubs daily

Live or dry? Kinda high in fat for daily use. (at meal worms were, I can't remember grubs currently)

Seems like you are still "treating" those ladies WAY too much, to me.

You can read what I had been doing in my About Intro.

You sate you worm with DE... Total crud. Have you done before and after fecal floats to determine you load and species count to see if you even need to treat? Has ANYBODY who treats this way done before and afters???!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diatomaceous_earth

"Medical-grade diatomite has been studied for its efficacy as a deworming agent in cattle; in both studies cited the groups being treated with diatomaceous earth did not fare any better than control groups."

"Natural freshwater diatomaceous earth is used in agriculture for grain storage as an anticaking agent, as well as an insecticide.[19] It is approved by the Food and Drug Administration as a feed additive[20] to prevent caking."

My understanding further is that DE is very crumbly soft so after going through the gizzard it may be irrelevant and smooth. But also that when it gets wet it becomes ineffective. I think this also smooths it (but I wonder if it gets sharp again after it dries). The gut is wet. If the gut is a wet place, whether smoothed or not, how will any worms dehydrate, if that is the alleged mode of operation?

I fermented for almost 2 years, and have my own personal reserves towards it since the feed IS already formulated to meet the needs of chickens. People always talk about what improves but not what changes. You don't just get something for nothing in my experience. So by changing the original formulation I'm saying I somehow know better than the experts... Well ok, sometimes. Most feeds I have seen also have all the probiotics added in already that are raved about from FF. My birds are still healthy just as much as before and I have more free time. Anyways, each to their own. It wasn't a terrible experience and there were no ill side effects. I just decided after doing more research that it wasn't right for me AND not ALL the claims made are accurate. It did save 1 bird who wasn't drinking for a couple weeks before I had to cull anyways. What made we stick with as long as I did was the change in poo smell and the illusion that I could afford more chicken math! But I suspect with all the other feeds that isn't a benefit you are getting from FF.

1/3 cup each of sprouted Wheat, Barley, Oats, and Peas.

I love sprouting and growing fodder for my chickens! 1/3 cup each is another 1.33 cups/day. That seems excessive for 8 birds, to me. I guess I am picturing that being the pre sprouted measurement. Maybe consider doing an individual grain per evening so they get variety still but less excess. Maybe 1/2 cup each night of something different than the night before?

You VERY clearly want to take care of your birds. Wow your supply list was immense!

I'm so sorry for your loss.

Sorry for being a tad off topic. To me it's all relevant though. I promise I would LAY OFF all the extra pumpkin this and mixed veg or salad that. It isn't doing the shooks as much good as you might think and maybe more harm than not. I would replace a lot of the salad stuff with sprouts which have much more protein, vitamins and minerals than the lettuce or cooked carrots/peas/corn... whatever your mix is. Would benefit them more in the raw form than having the nutrients depleted by cooking. Using Nutri drench every day might be excessive too. It has E in it which can be overdosed on. And NO supplement should be given more than 10 days in a row. Sorry, there I go again.

Anyways, I am here to learn as well, probably should have spent my time to post this on your other thread instead of here, and seriously do not mean to pick on you.

 

[Sassysouth]

I learned that the hard way myself. I fed corn and flock raiser every day. I culled a roo and it was coated in fat on every organ in his body. Then lost a hen to prolapse before I realized the corn was doing it . Treats 10% of their diet not 50/50 like I was doing .

Is flock raiser okay though?

 

[Granny Hatchet]

Is flock raiser okay though?

flock raiser is my favorite. If hens are laying a dish of calcium on the side and they will eat what they need of it.

 

[Folly's place]

Flock Raiser is a nice diet, good for chickens of all ages, laying or not, as long as there's oyster shell offered on the side. We like to be 'nice' to our birds and bring goodies, but too much messes up the balanced diet. Think about eating a couple pieces of chocolate, or a whole box at once!
Just offer their base diet, and few or zero treats, and hopefully the other birds will do fine.
Mary

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Is flock raiser okay though?

Flock raiser is what I have used for years now. Every since I learned about dual purpose breeds verses light bodied layers and the 16% protein being the MINIMUM needed to sustain a light bodied hen laying. I also learned that too much calcium for my ladies who were molting wasn't ideal. But since then I have added a never ending supply of chicks to my flock. With all the broody's, chicks, and boys... it is a happy medium for my flock.

It should be perfectly OK!

 

[Kathy Golla]

Good job @Michael Propst for weighing in.
I was just going to tag you to join the conversation.