Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[colburg]

In response to Karens question about who has what on their farm.

We decided to start with White Rocks. We've only had them since December and just started our first batch, 1/2 under a broody, 1/2 in the incubator so anything I say is not based on experience.

The reasons we chose WR's is
1) solid color - Solid colors that breed true are easier to train your eye on so that you don't get lost on color. This will give us time to develope an eye for type. Also, we're still learning rotation patterns that suit our irrigation needs, and trying to learn how to set up rotational grazing pens and patterns with our dairy cow and chickens in a flood irrigated orchard.

2) Easy(er) to start with good stock. We only had to travel 16hrs(round trip) to get our beginners breeding stock. So far we've been impressed with our WR's size and laying.

3) Extensive gene pool to chose from. Though it won't be cheap, we can easily find new good blood if we mess up our plans and start losing vigor.

4) Dual Purpose - These WR's are laying about 5 eggs/week each and all of the males were approaching 10lbs at 1 year old. We're going to monitor this years hatches for growth rate and bottom 50% at 20wks will probably not be used for breeding. That's not set in stone, but it's the current plan.

That's all I've got for now.

colburg

 

[Serica]

Thanks. I guess we shouldn't let numbers daunt us. If we take our time and find the right breed for us and then the right birds somewhere along the line a contribution has been made. Be it supporting a breeder or eventually getting a few "out" there, it's something as long as that something is quality SOP birds.

 

[gjensen]

Interesting thread and perhaps a bit ... disheartening? We have a small flock of Silkies for fun and have decided to expand into a dual purpose bird for meat and eggs. I've done some checking around and reading before making the plunge. The heritage birds appealed to me and my husband as they represented so many things we are loosing to a faster, more, poor quality society we are turning in to.

I guess I'm feeling like it's pointless to try because there's no way we can produce hundreds of birds a year. It's just him and I on 5 acres of land. Am I right in feeling its pointless and we can't even make a small contribution?

You do not have to hatch hundreds. Just pick a strain that is already in good shape. Raise what you do hatch well.

If you get the best that is available, and the strain has some popularity, you do not have to have as much depth and still do well. Just don't replace your entire breeding flock every year of course. Raise 40 and keep a quad, for example. And you can make progress to. Just not as fast as you would if you hatched twice as many.

Everyone' situation is different. We have to come up with our own plan, and know what we are able to do.

Just do not pick the rarest of the rare, and in poor shape. Projects like these require a lot more than buying good birds. It helps to start slow anyways. You do not want it to become a chore. You want to enjoy it. You will know better what you want and can do after a couple rounds.

 

[bmvf]

You do not have to hatch hundreds. Just pick a strain that is already in good shape. Raise what you do hatch well.

If you get the best that is available, and the strain has some popularity, you do not have to have as much depth and still do well. Just don't replace your entire breeding flock every year of course. Raise 40 and keep a quad, for example. And you can make progress to. Just not as fast as you would if you hatched twice as many.

Everyone' situation is different. We have to come up with our own plan, and know what we are able to do.

Just do not pick the rarest of the rare, and in poor shape. Projects like these require a lot more than buying good birds. It helps to start slow anyways. You do not want it to become a chore. You want to enjoy it. You will know better what you want and can do after a couple rounds.

Thank you for this post. What you are saying helps a beginner like myself by simplifying the overwhelming task of just choosing a breed let alone breeding chickens.

 

[bmvf]

I farm for a living. Each breed of livestock is not required to "make a profit" but each is required to feed us and be self supporting (as a minimum).
I have primarily HRIR and Rhodebars, but keep a pen of production layers who are egg laying, flash on the pan, machines. In the past they have supported the other two breeds. Within the next 2 years (i simply don't have enough quantity yet) those breeds will be productive enough to be self supporting for both meat and eggs.
We are a farm... Our number 1 rule: "You must have a job and earn your keep" (that applies to teenagers too). ;-)

I appreciated one of your posts on the production chicken thread and i appreciate your outlook for your various livestock. My dairy cows need to make a profit to pay for the farm and support me and my family. But, the cats and dog aren't making me a profit. The cats keep the mice down and the dog wakes me up if the cows get out. The chickens just need to lay eggs and grow cheap enough that I don't waste too much money feeding them.

Your number 1 rule, does it apply to 4 year olds with too much energy?

 

[B4chicks]

Hello,
My name is Scott and I have found this thread to be very interesting, as was the original Blosl thread.I have read here for over a year and decided to finally join as we are about one month away,I hope , of beginning our journey into Heritage Poultry. I have read most of Mr. Blosl's site, Yellow House Farm site,reread the poultry section of our 1905 Cyclopedia of Agriculture and many other sources to begin what I hope is a long term furthering of my education in chickens. I think we are choosing Rose Comb RIR. I am confident that will work out well for our needs, and it doesn't hurt that RIR are the one breed that my father in law kept bred true for the hen house.As opposed to other breeds that were always crossed with the game roosters that ruled the barnyard flock. I was wishing that some here could point me in the direction of some honest birds for the foundation of our flock. We are in CNY but are always up for a nice day trip.

 

[pigsflyacres]

Interesting thread and perhaps a bit ... disheartening? We have a small flock of Silkies for fun and have decided to expand into a dual purpose bird for meat and eggs. I've done some checking around and reading before making the plunge. The heritage birds appealed to me and my husband as they represented so many things we are loosing to a faster, more, poor quality society we are turning in to.

I guess I'm feeling like it's pointless to try because there's no way we can produce hundreds of birds a year. It's just him and I on 5 acres of land. Am I right in feeling its pointless and we can't even make a small contribution?

Don't be disheartened. You just need to know what you can commit to. Here is what I've committed to. I've tried before and I failed because I didn't understand what infrastructure I needed to breed for 'improvement'. That is the key. Do you want to be a breeder? I do.

So in the ensuing years I've built a layer house with attached run and storage shed. I will be throwing my layers, young chicks and young pullets in there. I have a moveable hoop tractor for my young cockerels. I'll slap together another so I can separate my culls from my probable keepers. I'm in the process of building breeder pens. 4 4 x10 pens that I've made with flexibility. I can remove partitions and keep broodies in certain sections etc. It's kind of fussy work, but I like it. The whole area is enclosed so I can rotate free range.

The numbers of my actual breeding flock shouldn't get over 20 and could go as low as 12. I will be focusing all my efforts on Red Dorkings. My plan is to hatch 100 chicks. I will keep 8 to 10%. I hate to process chickens. Really, I do have other things demanding my time and because I hate to do it, I will procrastinate. I have someone who processes for me. I'm good with that. This is my hobby, I don't have to turn a profit. I am perfectly fine taking the head of anything that nails me. I will have no problem getting rid of pullets who don't make the cut and are at pol or laying.

I also live on 5 acres. Its not even all useable. Most of it is a wet land or heavily wooded.

You don't have to be a breeder. You can be someone who picks an easy to find DP breed. Go to a breeder than has good stock buy chicks and raise them up. Do a rolling mating which requires less effort, and in 5 years go back and get some more stock if you need to. You can hatch out fewer chicks. You will make less progress if your aim is to improve the breed. But you can really enjoy your chickens either way. Either way you're supporting heritage chickens. There is no right or wrong. Its about what you want. Yes, we need more committed breeders. But not everyone wants to be a committed breeder. You just need to decide what you want.

 

[gjensen]

I tried to make too much of it too fast. Keep it simple to start with. Listen to what others say about depth etc. It is relevant. I am just saying to start small and grow into it.

I think two families from a couple trios is a good start. You can build depth over time. It takes a couple generations just to really know what you have.

Heck, I do not know what is wrong for a beginner to flock mate a generation or two. Once you see that bird you like, build a family off of her or him.

I started by flock mating a good while back. They were just hatchery birds. I found a male that I liked more than the others. I realized I wanted more like him so bred his daughters back to him. Picked a son from him and set up another pen. I started to line breed before I knew what line breeding was.

I think it is best to get some good birds, and enjoy raising them for a generation or two. It takes a little time to know what you have and know what they are supposed to be.

I compare it to gardening. if you enjoy doing it, you will keep doing it. That is what a gardener is. One who gardens. A gardener does not become a master gardener in a year.

 

[gjensen]

Hello,
My name is Scott and I have found this thread to be very interesting, as was the original Blosl thread.I have read here for over a year and decided to finally join as we are about one month away,I hope , of beginning our journey into Heritage Poultry. I have read most of Mr. Blosl's site, Yellow House Farm site,reread the poultry section of our 1905 Cyclopedia of Agriculture and many other sources to begin what I hope is a long term furthering of my education in chickens. I think we are choosing Rose Comb RIR. I am confident that will work out well for our needs, and it doesn't hurt that RIR are the one breed that my father in law kept bred true for the hen house.As opposed to other breeds that were always crossed with the game roosters that ruled the barnyard flock. I was wishing that some here could point me in the direction of some honest birds for the foundation of our flock. We are in CNY but are always up for a nice day trip.

Hello,
My name is Scott and I have found this thread to be very interesting, as was the original Blosl thread.I have read here for over a year and decided to finally join as we are about one month away,I hope , of beginning our journey into Heritage Poultry. I have read most of Mr. Blosl's site, Yellow House Farm site,reread the poultry section of our 1905 Cyclopedia of Agriculture and many other sources to begin what I hope is a long term furthering of my education in chickens. I think we are choosing Rose Comb RIR. I am confident that will work out well for our needs, and it doesn't hurt that RIR are the one breed that my father in law kept bred true for the hen house.As opposed to other breeds that were always crossed with the game roosters that ruled the barnyard flock. I was wishing that some here could point me in the direction of some honest birds for the foundation of our flock. We are in CNY but are always up for a nice day trip.

NY Reds should know where some Reds are in that part of the country.

 

[RedRidge]

... But, the cats and dog aren't making me a profit. The cats keep the mice down and the dog wakes me up if the cows get out. The chickens just need to lay eggs and grow cheap enough that I don't waste too much money feeding them.

Your number 1 rule, does it apply to 4 year olds with too much energy?

They don't have to make a profit... they just have to earn their keep.
I can't imagine the mouse problem I would have without my 2 barn cats.
And the 4 maremma? OMG, they are the hardest working of all. I haven't lost chick, lamb, or calf since getting the maremma.
They eat 4 cups of kibble a day each... cheap by ANY stretch for all the fox, coyotes, hawks, and big cats they fend off.
So see? they earn their keep.

The 4 year old is easy... I've had 3... wish I still did. ROFL

It's the teenagers who take more thought...
Just never introduce them to anything electronic - including a tv or dishwasher.
Buy a stool instead... dishwashing CAN be fun when you are 4.
Same with laundry... as soon as they can reach the bottom of the washer (usually about 10) they do their own laundry.
There are eggs to collect, lgds to feed, 3 gardens to weed, veggies to pick... all worth the double time it takes, the broken eggs, and the smashed tomatoes to teach work ethic.
But boy howdy... some days... wears me out just remembering.

I guess I never did get it all done. But... in hindsight... was getting it all done that important? nah... not so much.
I've been blessed with 3 little work-a-holics... they put a smile on my face every day.
Enjoy it... especially since no one has yet to figured out how to keep them that age.