Castor Oil for inflamed bumblefoot?

[Moments]

Been learning a lot about castor oil and wondering if anyone has had results with it in relation to bumblefoot? I brought to the vet and she prescribed antibiotics because of the blueish color of the swollen area above the hard part of the bumble. I'd prefer not to use if I don't need to because of wanting to sell the eggs. Some won't buy if the duck has ever been on antibiotics and I'd prefer holistic. It occured to me castor oil might work because of its abilities and when I searched it brought me to an old post on here where a woman said she used it to heal bumble and didn't have to lance it and remove the core. I asked about it on that thread but was recommended to start my own. This is what it looked like yesterday. I've been soaking with Epsom and doing Epsom poultice since before this inflammation began.

 

[nuthatched]

It's necessary to remove the core 95% of the time. Typically, you need a topical antibiotic such as neosporin afterwards, but maybe not oral. You definitely need to open that and drain it.. the blue might be just a bruise, or it could be infection spreading to the tissues. Infection puts the entire body under stress so you can't faff around.
Please bare in mind, According to the usda, when it comes to organic animal raising, refusal to treat animals with the proper medication, is considered to be animal abuse. I'm not saying youre doing that, just giving you information. Most antibiotics are out of the system within 6 weeks so you don't need to worry about antibiotics in the eggs unless you're regularly feeding them oregano or similar.

 

[Moments]

It's necessary to remove the core 95% of the time. Typically, you need a topical antibiotic such as neosporin afterwards, but maybe not oral. You definitely need to open that and drain it.. the blue might be just a bruise, or it could be infection spreading to the tissues. Infection puts the entire body under stress so you can't faff around.
Please bare in mind, According to the usda, when it comes to organic animal raising, refusal to treat animals with the proper medication, is considered to be animal abuse. I'm not saying youre doing that, just giving you information. Most antibiotics are out of the system within 6 weeks so you don't need to worry about antibiotics in the eggs unless you're regularly feeding them oregano or similar.

Understandably but at the same time my vet said removing the core often causes more harm than good and usually prefers not to do it and let the body absorb it. She doesn't want to remove it, I asked. Even though most antibiotics are out of the system within a certain period of time I have people that don't want eggs from ducks who have had antibiotics (other than natural like oregano) at any time which means I would have to separate her. I have been giving her oregano oil in her water daily. I have another duck that I can't sell her eggs at all because a different vet from the same practice prescribed an antibiotic that turned out to be banned by the FDA for use in poultry and has no withdrawal period according to the FDA (the vet i saw this time agreed it shouldn't be prescribed to poultry). Right now I can tell which eggs are hers but I won't be able to forever and she'll have to be separated as well at some point so I might have to put the one who has bumble currently with her. The antibiotic the vet prescribed for my girl with bumble is in pill form and she's a very fiery duck with a strong personality and it is not going to be easy giving her that pill. Doesn't matter if you try wrapping her or whatever she jellyfishes right out of it, and that's with two people lol. When the vet was examining her they took her to the other room which is just off the waiting room and we could hear them struggling with her and I think she got away from her and her assistant cuz I could hear commotion in the other room, the duck quacking them saying Oh no... Etc. When she came out to talk to me about her she looked like she just been through the ringer
She acts like herself, behavior is fine, eating great you would never know there's anything wrong with her, she's not even limping other than looking at her foot
Also when it first started getting puffed up around the scab and look like fluid under there I had noticed when I was changing her bandage that it had separated from the foot a little bit and there was some fluid leaking out, so I pressed on a little bit to see if I could expel some and not much came out. When I talked to the vet about it she said it's best to leave it alone and not try to express any fluids or anything like that because you can damage the tissues in the foot.

 

[Miss Lydia]

I have removed the core on my chickens and one duck and it is the only way to get this in fection out especially that one your showing . It's the only way to get it to start healing. Leaving it in there is going to cause the infection to spread.

 

[Moments]

It sounded like she wanted to try the antibiotic to see if it would work with removal as a last resort. She made it clear I shouldn't mess with it cause I could cause damage, etc. she said in her experience removing it often made it worse when in most cases it would resolve on its own with proper soaking, poultice and wrapping. It was flattening too for awhile, it's unfortunate it took a turn :-(

 

[Miss Lydia]

All I can say is once the infection is out the healing process begins.
Does this vet specialize in poultry?
What kind of damage?

With my Runner we took her to the vet she was on an antibiotic for 14 days but on day 7 nothing had changed so I opened it up just enough to get the core out packed with antibiotic ointment wrapped and she finished the antibiotic by mouth. This bumble had no scab so I used a scalpel and just made a small incision to pop out the core she was in pain walking on the bumble.

 

[Moments]

All I can say is once the infection is out the healing process begins.
Does this vet specialize in poultry?
What kind of damage?

With my Runner we took her to the vet she was on an antibiotic for 14 days but on day 7 nothing had changed so I opened it up just enough to get the core out packed with antibiotic ointment wrapped and she finished the antibiotic by mouth. This bumble had no scab so I used a scalpel and just made a small incision to pop out the core she was in pain walking on the bumble.

Hi! The practice is for exotics in addition to the regular dogs/cats, etc. She seems more knowledgeable than the other vet I saw with my other ducks that's for sure. She said tissue damage and can cause increased infection. When I had originally saw her with Fern was before it had gotten to this point and it was looking much better without the puffy inflammation. When it started I contacted her and sent pics. She said inflammation like this can be normal as part of the healing process and to keep an eye on it. When I saw her the second time she said because of the coloration that antibiotics are needed at this time. She said in her experience that doing the invasive surgery can often complicate things so she only likes to do so as a last resort.
Fern doesn't seem to be in any pain. In the very beginning she was limping and that's when I checked her foot and noticed the big hard bulge. By the next day she wasn't walking around much and wasn't really eating. I was able to get her to eat eggs for a couple days and peas of course, which she'd eat like a savage. I soaked her foot sprayed it, did the Epsom poultice and all that and before I knew it she was walking around, back to eating her feed, veggies and all that. Occasional limping once in a while (would be many days in-between) but she's all over the place. Oddly enough she's more active with it being worse than when I first noticed it. In the beginning she would get around but there was a lot of limping and a lot of breaks and a lot of laying down. And then it started getting better and she was coming around and moving around more and eating well and then it started getting worse but it didn't slow down or change any of her behaviors. Right now I'm separating her with another duck (alternating buddy ducks) in the night time enclosure because the vet said that moving around too much on the foot can aggravate it. So I got to try to get her to take it easy. She is not happy about it and makes it very clear. You would never know by how active she is that there's an issue with her foot. She runs, she's active on both feet, standing on both feet. Tail up when laying down for the most part. She looks and acts completely normal.

 

[CoriM]

I think I would try to get a second opinion on that. I have taken my ducks to an exotics/avian vet and they still never know what they're doing, because they rarely treat ducks. But at the very least I would pick the scab and squeeze anything out that comes out, put some triple antibiotic ointment in, or spray with vetricyn, then apply this epsom salt poultice, gauze pad on top, wrapped with vet wrap to hold in place. Then keep her foot dry - don't let her swim or be in mud - and change and reapply the poultice twice a day. Try that for a week and see if you see any improvements. It helps to draw the infection out. Here's a link to it on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001OE3L8...p=&crid=2691V1DBYNXLF&amp=&sprefix=epsom+salt

 

[Moments]

I think I would try to get a second opinion on that. I have taken my ducks to an exotics/avian vet and they still never know what they're doing, because they rarely treat ducks. But at the very least I would pick the scab and squeeze anything out that comes out, put some triple antibiotic ointment in, or spray with vetricyn, then apply this epsom salt poultice, gauze pad on top, wrapped with vet wrap to hold in place. Then keep her foot dry - don't let her swim or be in mud - and change and reapply the poultice twice a day. Try that for a week and see if you see any improvements. It helps to draw the infection out. Here's a link to it on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001OE3L8...p=&crid=2691V1DBYNXLF&amp=&sprefix=epsom+salt

I understand that completely. This is the 4th vet we've seen from the practice. And this is the only practice that does ducks, 45min drive, so it's hard to get a second opinion and the bank is draining from multiple appointments and our senior dog has an appointment at her vet tomorrow which is gonna be another chunk of change and we're not sure what the outcome is gonna be for her, she's not doing well. I am concerned myself having never done a procedure like this before that I'm gonna make it worse if I make a mistake and she's a difficult duck in general.
I've been using this brand Epsom poultice for weeks. It's in a tall narrow tube and is more of a gel but basically the same. Along with either the poultry vetericyn or MicrocynAH spray. A little while ago when there was less fluid buildup and the scab loosened on one side i pressed on it to get out some of the fluid (hardly any came out) and the vet told me i shouldn't have done that cause it could make it worse.
She's got such a wild personality that honestly I don't know how well I'd be able to do the surgery. She's difficult even with two people. With weeks of treating her foot she's mellowed out pretty well for me to soak her foot on my own but she will usually only allow 5 mins, maybe 10 (I think twice)... 5 is usually all she'll tolerate. When I tried to push out some of the fluid she fought me so I can only imagine how intense she'll be if I do an incision.

 

[CoriM]

I totally understand - the vet can drain the bank account so fast, and we don't always get the results we hope for. You can keep trying what the vet has suggested for awhile, but if you don't see big improvements in a week I would try another route. Everyone has a first time for doing these medical things with our ducks - frustration with the vet, and knowing my girls depend on me, were motivators for me to try to learn to take care of some of these medical issues on my own. In this case, it's not that difficult and I'm sure you can do this. Soak her foot in luke warm epsom salt water for 5 minutes until the scab is soft, then I would just use my fingernail to gently pull the brown scab off. I would kneel on the floor and tuck the duck under my arm (wrap her wings in a little towel if she's going to be difficult) and put her over my knee, then pull her leg gently back to work on the bottom of the foot. Work the scab off and try to squeeze any puss out, then apply the salve thickly. Have a pre-cut little gauze pad to put on that. The wrapping of the foot can be tricky with a wiggly duck, but once you get the hang of it, it works well. I cut two strips of one inch vet wrap about 16 inches long. Use the first one to kind of criss-cross the wound area, wrap once around the ankle, making sure nothing is too tight. I try to hold the webbing in the normal walking position - spread open, because you want her to be able to walk normally when it's wrapped. Use the 2nd piece of vet wrap to wrap around and hold everything in place. Here's some pictures of how I've done it. Usually I go between both toes with the wrap - this bumble did not need that.